Wizz Air flight cancellation reason

[breskica]

Our flight back to UK from Chania was cancelled while we were queuing for check in. Noone told us why was it canceled. After about an hour of waiting a lady came out with a stack of papers with instruction that we have to take care of our return flights and accommodation until then. We managed to book ourselves to the next available flight with them while all the rest of 200 people were frantically trying to book themselves in as well and shouting at the poor lady at the same time. She came out with a list of 10 names they were able to provide the overnight stay but because shouting was so loud we couldn’t hear a thing. We were extremely lucky we were able to go back to our Airbnb.
Well now… if anyone knows how can we find out why our flight was cancelled please let me know. And I am not calling wizzair premium rate to try to find out cos they probably won’t tell me or they will tell a lie so they don’t have to pay compensation and refund.

Thanks for any replies.

[yonasl]

Having had the same with Wizzair I can give you the following advice:
– Use their system to ask to be paid for the extra AirBNB night and any transport back and forth to the airport and food. This they have to pay for because of duty of care

As for compensation:
– Simply put an separate request on their system for EU261 compensation due to flight cancelation. They will most certainly reply saying it was exceptional circumstances. Reply back saying “Can you detail what the exceptional circumstances were and provide documented evidence”

Just to be clear, it is for the airline to prove the circumstance was exceptional and they have to show you why (the onus is on them).

Also: If you provide the flight number and date some people here can check on ExpertFlyer. We can also check what the plane did that day.

[breskica]

Thank you. Apparently the plane didn’t leave Gatwick. It was cancelled due to shortage of staff. That’s the information given to the passenger that was supposed to be on that flight to come to Greece. So the plane was cancelled in Gatwick at about 10 or 11 at night that’s more than 4 hours before it was supposed to get us back in England. So they knew plane is not arriving and yet they let all the people come to the airport and cancel it while we were already queuing to check in….
Flight number was W95742. Chania to Gatwick
Please if you can really check what was going on it would be great.

I was trying to reach customer service online agent all day today unsuccessfully and I can’t do anything online because the flight is not shown anywhere and I have no credit. Info about my flight disappeared and is not even showing in history….I had to buy flights back and had to use credit card instead of my wizz credit….

[yonasl]

Shortage of staff is not a exceptional circumstance. You don’t really need anything if they are saying that themselves. As I mentioned, pout two separate claims (one for hotels, food, transport) and another for compensation. Both should be paid but I had cases where they do one and not the other because they are not very organized and then you have to chase.

With Wizzair, it is important to use free tools like https://www.flightradar24.com/ to check your flight. If you are flying MAD to LGW you need to check the plane and see what route it has on that day (say LGW to CDG, then CDG to LGW then LGW to MAD …) usually delays start building up and Wizz will never let you know of that. I was in Romania when the runway in Luton melted and the flight that was supposed to pick us up landed in Stansted. Wizzair was simply delaying our flight by a few hours while I could see it was impossible it would take place at all. The 9pm flight was delayed to 1AM and sure enough at midnight they cancelled it. I can only imagine what the people at the airport must have endured. I was in bed at the time just checking the state of the booking every 30min.

[breskica]

I am now in the process of claiming the compensation for me and my partner and i need “power of attorney” document…
Where do i get that? do i have to pay for it? …
Please help…

[JDB]

breskica wrote:

I am now in the process of claiming the compensation for me and my partner and i need “power of attorney” document…
Where do i get that? do i have to pay for it? …
Please help…

They are being a bit ridiculous! In England, where presumably you are making the compensation claim, it is strictly not necessary to have a POA for this type of thing. It is good practice for Wizz to ensure that you are empowered to act for all the claimants, so you can either make individual claims to get round the problem entirely or just prepare a letter for your partner to sign on headed paper with his/her contact details :

To Whom It May Concern
I, ABC XYZ, hereby authorise my [relationship] DEF TUV, to act on my behalf in respect of a claim for compensation vs Wizzair for our booking ref: 12456 following delay/ cancellation of flight XX123 on X date. Signed / name/ date. PDF and attach. You can add stuff like passport numbers after each of your names to make it more official if you wish!

[breskica]

Thank You very much. I’ll do that and then we’ll see what happens.

[breskica]

An update on my claim status…. Nothing has happened. I am still waiting. Wizz air promise to contact the claimant within 30 days. It is now 32 days. I have been trying to contact them and have been unsuccessful as well.

Any suggestions on what should i do next?

Thanks.

[creterob]

We were due to take the Wizzair Gatwick to Chania flight on 13 September but it was cancelled at the gate. We were told that they did not have enough staff
So, at about 9-30pm in the evening, we were given a piece of paper and basically told to contact wizzair on their helpline and rebook. The next Gatwick – Chania flight was in 48 hours.
Their Helpline was continually busy so we decided to make our own arrangements. We stayed at a hotel at Gatwick over night and booked a new flight with Wizzair from Gatwick to Athens for the next morning. We then had to book another arline from Athens to Chania.

We claimed immediately for 4 x 400 euro for the compensation for the cancelled flight plus hotel expenses, refreshment expenses and the costs for the Athens to Chania flight with another airline. in total about 2700 euro

57 days later i have received a reply from Wizzair , saying that they will not pay any hotel expenses, refreshments or the flights to Chania with another airline. Their reason is that we are not entitled to it as we did not book another flight with wizzair. We actually did, but reading the regulations, this should not matter in any case.

For the 4 x 400 euro compensation amount they for the cancellation they have stated they will pay 400 euro only and it will have to be in credits to our wizzair account.

They have had a firm reply explaining to them that this is not acceptable.

Im not holding my breath for a quick reply.

Any other suggestions for what i can do ?

thanks in advance

[JDB]

creterob wrote:

We were due to take the Wizzair Gatwick to Chania flight on 13 September but it was cancelled at the gate. We were told that they did not have enough staff
So, at about 9-30pm in the evening, we were given a piece of paper and basically told to contact wizzair on their helpline and rebook. The next Gatwick – Chania flight was in 48 hours.
Their Helpline was continually busy so we decided to make our own arrangements. We stayed at a hotel at Gatwick over night and booked a new flight with Wizzair from Gatwick to Athens for the next morning. We then had to book another arline from Athens to Chania.

We claimed immediately for 4 x 400 euro for the compensation for the cancelled flight plus hotel expenses, refreshment expenses and the costs for the Athens to Chania flight with another airline. in total about 2700 euro

57 days later i have received a reply from Wizzair , saying that they will not pay any hotel expenses, refreshments or the flights to Chania with another airline. Their reason is that we are not entitled to it as we did not book another flight with wizzair. We actually did, but reading the regulations, this should not matter in any case.

For the 4 x 400 euro compensation amount they for the cancellation they have stated they will pay 400 euro only and it will have to be in credits to our wizzair account.

They have had a firm reply explaining to them that this is not acceptable.

Im not holding my breath for a quick reply.

Any other suggestions for what i can do ?

thanks in advance

Wizz are a law unto themselves and one cannot even count on them complying with court orders. It sounds as though you have just written anyway, but if they don’t respond to that, write again in a proper letter format which you should email and post to their registered UK office. This letter should clearly and succinctly set out the facts, the law as it applies to those facts and Wizz’s failure to comply with UK261, CAA rerouting guidelines or the CMA/CAA July letter. Give them 14 days to respond after which tell them you will issue a claim at MCOL or seek arbitration via AviationADR (probably the preferred option here).

In respect of the €400 there should be no issue that this be paid in cash not credit and it’s helpful to have the de facto admission of liability. The rest is unfortunately a bit grey. You are always at risk if you go and make your own arrangements, even though we would probably all do the same. I’m not saying they are right, but they will argue that you were offered the opportunity to rebook with Wizz but elected not to take that option, so they aren’t liable for additional accommodation/flight/meal costs just because you say you couldn’t get through to them.

[Lady London]

Sounds like they should be paying up in full. Passengers should only have to prove they made reasonable efforts to contact the airline in the circumstances and may have been hampered by various factors in doing this.

The airline is actually supposed to provide its proposals at the same time as cancelling you and they didn’t.

We’ve had a number of reports of Wizz being very “old Eastern European” just mistreating people when they’ve dumped flights for their own reasons so please go after them and report back

[JDB]

Lady London wrote:

Sounds like they should be paying up in full. Passengers should only have to prove they made reasonable efforts to contact the airline in the circumstances and may have been hampered by various factors in doing this.

The airline is actually supposed to provide its proposals at the same time as cancelling you and they didn’t.

We’ve had a number of reports of Wizz being very “old Eastern European” just mistreating people when they’ve dumped flights for their own reasons so please go after them and report back

Many airlines will accept what you say when pressed, but what the law says it slightly different:-

“However, where an air carrier can demonstrate that when the passenger has accepted to give his or her personal contact details, it has contacted a passenger and sought to provide the assistance required by Article 8, but the passenger has nonetheless made his or her own assistance or re-routing arrangements, then the air carrier may conclude that it is not responsible for any additional costs the passenger has incurred and may decide not to reimburse them.”

[Lady London]

@JDB @creterob said “We were due to take the Wizzair Gatwick to Chania flight on 13 September but it was cancelled at the gate. We were told that they did not have enough staff. So, at about 9-30pm in the evening, we were given a piece of paper and basically told to contact wizzair on their helpline and rebook. The next Gatwick – Chania flight was in 48 hours.
Their Helpline was continually busy so we decided to make our own arrangements.”

Article 5 (2) on Cancellation of EU261, mirrored in its UK equivalent APR: “When passengers are informed of the cancellation, an explanation shall be given concerning possible
alternative transport.” I don’t consider Wizz did this adequately.

The passenger was abandoned at 9.30pm at the gate at the airport and had to make efforts to discern what alternative transportation was available. That turned out to be 48 hours later in the case of Wizz flights. However other flights considerably earlier were actually available much sooner, which Wizz has an obligation to provide under ‘as near as reasonably possible’ requirement which Wizz completely failed to inform of at any time. So Wizz failed to provide the information required.

There is no mention that Wizz made any attempt to provide acommodation either as per Article 5 (b) Cancellation referring to Article 9 (1) (b) (Duty of Care)

Wizz failed to provide what was required by statute and given this was a 9.30pm flight and the passenger was dumped at the airport without assistance, did this cynically. I think Wizz should pay all and it looks like the law says so.

[PeteM]

Lady London wrote:

Wizz being very “old Eastern European”

You mean exactly what Ryanair also does regularly…?

[JDB]

@Lady London your post suggests you have seen the Notice provided to the pax by Wizzair?? If that Notice is compliant and the pax chooses to do something different, they are at risk.

[Nigel Keya]

Sue them, it won’t cost you anything as you’ll win. Slam dunk.

[PeteM]

Nigel Keya wrote:

Sue them, it won’t cost you anything as you’ll win. Slam dunk.

Good luck enforcing the judgement…

[JDB]

Nigel Keya wrote:

Sue them, it won’t cost you anything as you’ll win. Slam dunk.

It isn’t a slam dunk for some of the costs incurred. When you make your own arrangements, the burden of proof falls back on you and the law I cited above comes into play. It is actually very rare for cases to be slam dunks; litigation risk carries a big discount.

The pax would also be required to pay upfront £115 court fees and maybe £181 hearing fee. If he wins, they may not pay and enforcement costs money and isn’t straightforward. If they ignore the claim and you get a default judgment this is even more likely and further complications arise. I believe you would have better prospects of enforcement of an arbitration in your favour. Making and pursuing an MCOL is in principle simple but does require some knowledge of how to present a legal argument and real tenacity.

For all these reasons, and the nature of this defendant, it would be much more advisable to go to AviationADR if they can’t be pressed into co-operating which is obviously what needs to be the priority at this stage.

[Nigel Keya]

I guess it’s easier to go for Section 75 (ie via your credit card co) – and let them recover the costs. You get refunded nice & fast/ they can sort out their own arrangements.

Kids: always pay for tickets on credit cards (not debit cards or charge cards). Otherwise S75 doesn’t apply.

[JDB]

Nigel Keya wrote:

I guess it’s easier to go for Section 75 (ie via your credit card co) – and let them recover the costs. You get refunded nice & fast/ they can sort out their own arrangements.

Kids: always pay for tickets on credit cards (not debit cards or charge cards). Otherwise S75 doesn’t apply.

s75 won’t work for the 4 x €400 which makes up 60% of this claim. Could possibly work for some of the other bits, but before the card provider will consider your claim under s75 they will seek a chargeback / refund which then compromises your EC261 rights. s75 that provides protection vs breaches of contract and misrepresentation but is not a back door to 261 rights which don’t form part of your contract but are separate statutory rights that credit card companies are not required to take on.

[Lady London]

@JDB you keep saying cardco can decide to do a chargeback. If you go to the cardco you paid with, with an s75 claim you are invoking the cardco’s joint liabilility for what you purchased. This is completely different from a chargeback.

Note that joint liability in this sense doesn’t mean splitting the liability between cardco and airline. It means either cardco, or airline, can standalone be liable for the whole purchase, as well as jointly.

s75 does cover you for contractual rights and naturally, as a statute is a statute and applies regardless of anything in, or not in, a contract, your statutory rights under EU261/UK261 are inherent in your purchase so cardco is liable for your statutory rights in that purchase too. This is how s75 covers you for consequential losses of the other party, the airline, not providing the flight purchased or any statutory right that comes with that purchase.

Chargeback is a voluntary scheme operated by the card companies and is limited basically, to the cardco reversing a transaction on the vendor. Which does not provide you your full rights.

Of course cardco would prefer to chargeback as their own skin is not involved. Section 75 makes the cardco liable and you should insist on invoking Section 75 which is provided by statute, to things purchased on UK issued credit (not debit and not charge) cards

If you have both UK credit cards & other cards such as charge cards, it’s technically sufficient to put £1 of the purchase on the UK credit card, for the entire amount to receive s75 protection.

[JDB]

@LL a card company will always try a chargeback first – they cannot be expected to take the joint liability without trying to get the other party to pay. If they fail to get your money back, they will consider it under s75. Your contractual rights with the airline are quite separate from the airline’s statutory 261 obligations. A credit card company is also simply not equipped to assess 261 compensation claims. It’s ludicrous.

[Lady London]

Of course it’s ludicrous JDB but that’s the law. And for once it operates in the passenger’s / consumer’s favour.

Any issue of who ultimately pays is between the UK cardco and the airline and doesn’t concern you. So long as one of those two still exists, you have a right to what you purchased and statutory rights pertaining to it – you don’t care which of then pays it’s not your problem.

Similar to insurancw companies, card co’s can afford to hire competent lawyers to recover money a consumer may not be able to force to be paid to them even where they’ve a perfect right to it.

So it’s all good for me. If you have s75 rights insist on exercising them with the cardco. The rest is not your concern.

[JDB]

Lady London wrote:

Of course it’s ludicrous JDB but that’s the law. And for once it operates in the passenger’s / consumer’s favour.

It is not the ‘law’ as you call it. S75 explicitly covers only breaches of contract and misrepresentation and failure to provide or correctly apply 261 is neither. The idea that after some of the CEDR fails reported here, the pax can then go to their card company and claim on s75 instead is so ridiculous.

Anyway it’s terrible advice based on zero evidence, just a guess that s75 must be a back door to 261. Card providers are not so stupid. There are proper and free routes to escalate airline failures to comply and any card company would also expect those to be used.

[Lady London]

Lady London wrote:

Of course it’s ludicrous JDB but that’s the law. And for once it operates in the passenger’s / consumer’s favour.

Any issue of who ultimately pays is between the UK cardco and the airline and doesn’t concern you. So long as one of those two still exists, you have a right to what you purchased and statutory rights pertaining to it – you don’t care which of then pays it’s not your problem.

Similar to insurance companies, cardco’s can afford to hire competent lawyers to recover money a consumer may not be able to force to be paid to them even where they’ve a perfect right to it.

So it’s all good for me. If you have s75 rights insist on exercising them with the cardco. The rest is not your concern.