BA flight cancelled. Downgraded from Club to Traveller on earlier flight.
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My BA Lax -lhr flight was cancelled with around 14 hours notice. I had booked 2 club class returns with my 241 voucher and this was the return leg. I was offered an AA flight in economy leaving an hour later . I tried for hours on chat and phone with Ba to find alternative flights and eventually accepted flights in traveller on a BA flight leaving 2 hours earlier than the original cancelled flight. I’ve claimed for the difference between club and traveller ( in fees Avios and charges) plus eu261 compensation. I’ve also asked for my 241 to be reinstated as I would never have wasted it on an economy flight given that I pay £250 a year in order to get the far superior 241 that comes with the BAPP card. Any idea what sort of compensation and refund I should expect?
Firstly, the downgrade calculation should be 75% of the actual fare paid (excluding real charges, not airline ones and if Y charges are lower, that too should be taken into account) per person, even though you used a 241. This will be much more than the difference between the classes you say you have claimed.
Any entitlement to EC261 cancellation will depend on the reason; in recent days at both ends of this route, weather may have been a factor and would constitute ‘exceptional circumstances’. If you were eligible, it’s £520 per person. I think you will have a devil’s own job getting the voucher reinstated and, if refused, you would have no statutory recourse.
Thanks. Should I edit/update my claim or will BA automatically compensate me the correct amount based off the 75% formula? Seems like I have asked for less compensation than I’m actually due? I guess I’ve asked for around 50,000 Avios and around £200 each ( fees and charges) as a refund for the downgrade . Any idea how much I’m actually entitled to
Original flight was 6pm on Saturday 4th March. 17 hours before the flight they offered me economy seats on the 7:08pm AA flight but I managed to switch instead to the 3:45pm BA flight. The 6pm flight was the only one cancelled so it’s unlikely they can blame weather conditions?
You can claim EC261 via the form on ba.com.
Note that they may try to refuse payment for the 2nd person on the grounds that the ticket was ‘free’. BA has lost more arbitration claims on this than we can count but it doesn’t mean they won’t try it on.
Zero chance of getting the 241 back.
Unless there were genuinely no seats on any airline out of LA then BA did not follow the rules in refusing to rebook you and you could go to CEDR for extra compensation, albeit you’d need to have screenshots showing seats were bookable in Business.
I have claimed 261 on their form at the same time as asking for downgrade compensation (which I seem to have underestimated so I need to know whether I should edit/update my claim?)
2nd seat was £850 in fees and charges so I certainly hope it they don’t consider it to be free!
Ba offered me club class seats the following day but I had to be back on the Sunday so this wasnt acceptable
There were traveller plus seats on another flight but they refused to offer them to me. I have the chat conversation to prove this. there was also a 1st class and economy seat on another flight. I offered to take the economy as long as my partner could have the 1st class but again they refused
In respect of the cancellation, it’s still possible your flight was cancelled for ATC/weather restrictions if airlines were required to reduce flights, but there may well have been a totally different reason that makes you eligible for cancellation the compensation.
I think I will only be eligible for 50% ec261 compensation as my rearranged flight took off 2 1/4 hours earlier than my original flight
On the chat I was advised to claim back the difference in tax and fees which is why I didn’t claim as much as I’m entitled to. Should I edit my claim or can I rely on BA to pay the correct amount?
I think I will only be eligible for 50% ec261 compensation as my rearranged flight took off 2 1/4 hours earlier than my original flight
On the chat I was advised to claim back the difference in tax and fees which is why I didn’t claim as much as I’m entitled to. Should I edit my claim or can I rely on BA to pay the correct amount?
Under EC261 you would have been entitled to the full compensation but it’s UK261 that applies here and that may not entitle you to any compensation for an earlier arrival as the ECJ decision relating to this post dates Brexit. I think you do need to edit your claim to improve your prospects. You will need to be very precise and firm in your communications with BA. They do occasionally play nice, but are generally rather incompetent/obstructive. In fact in this instance you need to be very specific that your downgrade was involuntary; they may say you agreed to be downgraded. Also, they may try to suggest that as you moved to an AA flight departing from the US, no UK261 rights attach to that flight which is in a strict sense correct – eg if it had arrived late, no compensation would have been due.
Did they offer anything flying the next day at all, even 1 stop?
Yes they offered to fly me the next day but that wasn’t acceptable for work reasons. They couldn’t offer me any business or premium economy same day but offered an economy AA136 flight leaving at 7:49. After trying several other options I reluctantly accepted the 15:45 flight which was an economy BA flight so I think I should be entitled to cancellation compensation at 50%?
At least it was a Dreamliner and not a B777.
Under EC261 you would have been entitled to the full compensation but it’s UK261 that applies here and that may not entitle you to any compensation for an earlier arrival as the ECJ decision relating to this post dates Brexit.
Isn’t raynerdom entitled to half the compensation regardless (as he says above)?
Also I’m in this situation, with the airline referring to their “policy” (to pay half, which they have done) and completely ignoring my references to the AzurAir case. What do you think is the best way to pursue it further?
Under EC261 you would have been entitled to the full compensation but it’s UK261 that applies here and that may not entitle you to any compensation for an earlier arrival as the ECJ decision relating to this post dates Brexit.
Isn’t raynerdom entitled to half the compensation regardless? Also I’m in this situation, with the airline referring to their “policy” (to pay half, which they have done) and completely ignoring my references to the AzurAir case. What do you think is the best way to pursue it further?
If your case is under UK261, the Azurair case does not apply as the decision post dates Brexit so is not incorporated into English law. You could possibly make a case, but the wording of the one hour earlier/two hours later is very clumsy.
If your case is under UK261, the Azurair case does not apply as the decision post dates Brexit so is not incorporated into English law. You could possibly make a case, but the wording of the one hour earlier/two hours later is very clumsy.
The flight was France – UK.
If your case is under UK261, the Azurair case does not apply as the decision post dates Brexit so is not incorporated into English law. You could possibly make a case, but the wording of the one hour earlier/two hours later is very clumsy.
The flight was France – UK.
So, if you wished to pursue the matter in reliance on the Azurair case, you would have to do so in France or another EU country as the decision does not apply in the UK. Also, if you are talking about the additional 50% for a flight from France you are talking about rather inconsequential sums vs the OP who has/had the possibility of £520pp compensation + 75% downgrade reimbursement.
Thanks for that. Yes, the sums involved aren’t huge (though there are two of us). I’m just rather miffed that I lost more than a full day of my week’s holiday.
thanks everyone. i have updated my claim to reflect that i expect 75% of the club class fare for both passengers as downgrade compensation. I’ll let you know how i get on
got an email this morning to say my claim has been refused. no mention of downgrade compensation
“We’re sorry it was necessary to cancel your flight to London Heathrow on 4th March’23 and understand why you needed to get in contact about this. We take all reasonable measures to avoid cancelling a flight and we’ll always consider if there are any alternative solutions available before we make a decision. We’d also like to thank you for your patience while we got back to you about this.
Your claim’s been refused because BA0280 on 4th March’23 was cancelled due to the lack of the particular type of 777 aircraft model not available at the moment as the one that was already scheduled for your journey was stuck in Toronto airport due to snow. Please also note that you arrived on the rebooked flight within three hours of your originally scheduled arrival time as well. We take all reasonable measures to avoid disruption to a flight and we always consider if there are any other alternative solutions before we make a decision. The cancellation was out of our control and caused unforeseen disruption to our schedule.”
@raynerdom – you should obviously pursue BA for the downgrade reimbursement which should not be in doubt.
The cancellation/delay compensation is much harder since you arrived earlier than originally scheduled and the unavailability of an aircraft from a previous rotation caused by ‘extraordinary circumstances’ may apply to your flight. While neither judgment technically applies in the UK post Brexit, in theory, in the EU an earlier departure would entitle you to compensation but then the 22 April 2021 decision in WZ v Austrian Airlines allows airlines to claim ‘extraordinary circumstances’ to apply for an event three rotations back would scupper your claim. You could try taking your compensation claim to CEDR but realistically you quite unlikely to win.
thank you. i will chase them about downgrade compensation
you need to ask for REIMBURSEMENT because that’s what the regulation says you get with a downgrade!
ok thanks. ill update my claim to ask for reimbursement
they replied today to say i need to contact them seperately to claim a reimbursement. i initially added it to my claim for cancellation. obviously there is no section in their customer service portal that specifically deals with downgrade reimbursements
they are trying to get away with just refunding the difference. i have replied quoting caa rules about 75% reimbursement
3:20 PM
Dominic, I have raised the request to refund for the amount that is tax difference. I will not be able to share the details for the tax difference as it will be done by the refund team.
3:24 PM
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I am just trying if we can refund the avios for the fare difference at the moment.@raynerdom – unfortunately this is all par for the course. You will need to be very explicit that you are seeking reimbursement under Article 10 2(c) of 75% of the fare for BOTH passengers and that under 2. of the same Article, such reimbursement must be paid within seven days. You need to see what the Avios/taxes were for the return sector as the taxes at least will be lower as no APD, but check also if any of the taxes/real disbursed charges (for which you won’t get 75% back) are lower owing to travelling in Y/lowest class. As I also mentioned in a previous post, you also need to make it clear that your downgrade was involuntary – they may seek to claim that you agreed to it so it was voluntary, such that BA only needs to pay the difference which isn’t very much. As @Rob highlighted earlier up this thread BA also fairly systematically denies payment for the companion seat although they have lost many cases on this point.
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