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Hi,
My partner and I were booked on BA183 tonight, but whilst we were sat in the lounge we were told it was cancelled. We were automatically rebooked onto the Newark flight BA181 by the agent in the lounge (only NYC flight this eve).
Q1) This new flight is delayed and will land at EWR 1h30 later than our original JFK flight. I find the EU261 rules here quite complicated. Do we get any compensation for wrong airport and late?
Q2) We had booked seats 5E, 5F right at the front of the cabin in the middle pair. Partner is silver so we didn’t pay. On this rebooked flight all that’s left was way back in row 16 on opposite sides of the aisle. We booked using a 2-4-1 and we don’t get to do this very often, so we were super excited to be sat together. It’s also our five year anniversary. Any chance BA offer compensation for this?
Thanks all!
1. Technically they need to transport you to JFK from EWR and your actual arrival time at JFK would count as arrival time. So if you arrive 4h+ at JFK then yes, compensation applies.
2. No compensation for this. You may try a gesture of goodwill, but a long shot.
Thank you. Looks like this EWR flight is now further delayed (1:30am arrival will be fun!)
Realistically my accommodation is in Brooklyn so I don’t actually want to go to JFK – any ideas how I could prove that the total delay is 4+ hours once you include arriving on the wrong side of the city?
@meta the airline’s responsibility is only to pay to transport you to your originally booked airport when it’s within the same city/region. However, the delay compensation does not apply to your ground transportation arrival time. Apart from the facts, it would simply be impossible to provide proper evidence of arrival time by land transport and obviously open to abuse.
What was the reason for the original flight being cancelled? You will need to show that it wasn’t classed as e.g., weather or BA may well try to deny compo.
Not weather it seems. The new flight delay is due to “tow delay”.
Not weather it seems. The new flight delay is due to “tow delay”.
You effectively have two things in play – late arrival of the reroute and lateness of that flight, both with an ‘exceptional circumstances’. The first is one has the lower time threshold.
Lounge staff confirmed the first cancellation was due to the plane going tech, so I think it’s £260pp for being 2-4 hours late on rebooked flight.
Make timed and dated notes about who said what and when – this was really helpful for me a few years ago when BA tried to deny that the air con unit on our plane was broken and blamed the delay on the failure of JFK staff to supply an airbridge! I had to go to CEDR in the end but BA caved at that point and paid up.
@meta the airline’s responsibility is only to pay to transport you to your originally booked airport when it’s within the same city/region. However, the delay compensation does not apply to your ground transportation arrival time. Apart from the facts, it would simply be impossible to provide proper evidence of arrival time by land transport and obviously open to abuse.
Sorry JDB, but the time arrived at the booked airport by whatever means is what has to be compensated. Otherwise BA could land you at Manchester instead of Leeds and refuse to compensate and reimburse for the journey to Leeds at the time they landed you at MAN, taking you an extra x hours to get to the Leeds airport you’d paid for.
Ryanair used to do this a lot : landing people at a different airport then trying not to compensate, nor reimburse the extra time required to get to destination and this was one of the reasons EU261 was brought in. Are you saying BA can be as bad as Ryanair and get away with it?
Though granted, if the OP does not need to actually return to JFK it gets a bit stickier. And being totally fair about it, since they’d have been going to the same hotel from JFK as they will now from EWR, there might, being fair, not have been as much difference in inconvenience anyway.
However if landing at the right time at JFK would still have had faster cheaper transport options to the hotel, than turns out to be the case whenever they land at EWR, then for me morally BA should pay extra costs and compensate extra travel time.
However BA might technically not have to pay anything if the destination is the hotel rather than JFK. And the fact that BA denies so many valid claims means I won’t blame anyone for claiming whatever they can on any legal basis even if overall they might not have been so inconvenienced.
Even if you were about to take a JFK to NYC cab and you now take EWR to NYC it is still worth asking for compensation there (i.e.: the cab fare).
Maybe you chose JFK because Kramer was going to pick you up or you prefer the subway/train connection.
So worth a shot to keep the cab invoice and claiming for that.
Don’t worry too much about seating apart, it is a 6hrs flight.
@Lady London – as you presumably know, within the APR there is specific provision for arrival post rerouting at different airports within the same city or region or by agreement with the passenger. The airline is required to provide transportation between the two airports (and potentially only public transportation) but that’s the extent of it and the delay compensation timing is to the airport at which the aircraft lands; the airline doesn’t pay for road traffic delays etc.
You can apply for refund of the seat selection fees.
Thanks all. Fortunately the plane was switched to a 773 so we were able to sit together in a completely empty back section of Club World. Landing at EWR was fine in the end with same taxi time as JFK at 3am.
Our bags didn’t show up, naturally, but my wardrobe could do with a refresh courtesy of BA. Apparently those are being delivered to us tomorrow.
@Lady London – as you presumably know, within the APR there is specific provision for arrival post rerouting at different airports within the same city or region or by agreement with the passenger. The airline is required to provide transportation between the two airports (and potentially only public transportation) but that’s the extent of it and the delay compensation timing is to the airport at which the aircraft lands; the airline doesn’t pay for road traffic delays etc.
I was actually incorrectly referring to delay compensation whereas I meant cancellation compensation. Flight was cancelled less than 7 days. Rights under Article 8 (re-routing and transport to new airport) does not preclude rights under Article 7. There is (or was as I haven’t checked recently) currently a case at ECJ regarding precisely this scenario.
@Lady London – as you presumably know, within the APR there is specific provision for arrival post rerouting at different airports within the same city or region or by agreement with the passenger. The airline is required to provide transportation between the two airports (and potentially only public transportation) but that’s the extent of it and the delay compensation timing is to the airport at which the aircraft lands; the airline doesn’t pay for road traffic delays etc.I was actually incorrectly referring to delay compensation whereas I meant cancellation compensation. Flight was cancelled less than 7 days. Rights under Article 8 (re-routing and transport to new airport) does not preclude rights under Article 7. There is (or was as I haven’t checked recently) currently a case at ECJ regarding precisely this scenario.
@meta the case to which I think you may be referring is Airhelp Ltd v Scandinavian Airlines System a 23 March 2021 decision, so not one that applies in this case under UK261. I don’t think lower courts are going to find the decision at all helpful as while it establishes the point you suggest, as in the OP’s case, most people are going to travel to their hotel/home from the other airport rather than travel to the originally booked airport, unless their car is parked/booked there or some other reason. There can be no prospect of claiming delay compensation (or the rerouting delay) based on the timing of some theoretical trip to an airport and how anyone is going to prove to the satisfaction of a judge that they really did get caught up in terrible traffic on the M25 so they should be paid £520 compensation each I don’t know! It’s difficult to see airlines meekly paying up. I think it’s also quite an unhelpful decision as it increasingly highlights the absurdities and complexities within the rules that will ultimately lead to changes that might not be favourable.It’s also our five year anniversary. Any chance BA offer compensation for this?
Is your fifth anniversary so bad that it warrants compensation from BA? 😀
@JDB With proliferation of hail riding apps it’s easy to prove the departure and arrival time from point to point. The receipts you receive explicitly state this.
@JDB With proliferation of hail riding apps it’s easy to prove the departure and arrival time from point to point. The receipts you receive explicitly state this.
Yes, that aspect could be shown but the issue comes with comparing like with like. You would be comparing the arrival time at the originally booked airport after having cleared cleared immigration and customs at the rerouted airport rather than the ECJ stipulated doors open etc. There might be a delay while the car arrives etc. etc.
I’m sure you will agree that this makes a nonsense of the rules and no airline is going to pay on that basis.
Unfortunately, the Swedish lower court asked a theoretical question that wasn’t even directly pertinent to the case (and the defence of the case re location of the two airports was ridiculous) so it wasn’t tested in any practical sense. If anyone tries to claim on this basis there will surely be an appeal and anyone tries to use the case in the UK as evidence of how these things are considered in the EU, good luck.
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