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Hi
I had a flight returning from Berlin to Manchester via Zurich last week. The flight from Berlin was 20 minutes late landing and caused me to miss my already tight 50 minute connection. They had to put me on a flight the next morning so instead of getting to MAN at 17:55 on the 27th I arrived at 08.05 on the 28th. They put me up in a hotel so dont need to claim anything there but having emailed 3 times with the details to Swiss Air they have replied each time with standard ‘your flight was not delayed by more than 3 hours’… so its like banging my head against a brick wall.
Before I take this further I was hoping someone could confirm that this does indeed qualify for the EC261 compensation?
TIA
Well you certainly arrived to your final destination more than 3hrs late, so I can’t see how it wouldn’t apply? What was the reason for the original delay, do you know?
The reason for the delay is crucial – you will definitely need to find out what it was to make a claim against Swiss Air.
Swiss’s flight wasn’t late enough to trigger compo by itself probably. But they are accidentally or wilfully overlooking that the arrival time that matters is MAN not ZRH. That short time late departing, and if no particular announcements, says to me it’s highly likely not to be an exceptional curcumstance that exempts them from paying compensation.
So by all means try to ascertain what was the reason for late running but I’d press on with a claim anyway.
Where did you buy your ticket? which country? from Swiss or another airline?
@JDB hoping he can sue in UK?
@Concerto would you know to which body he can address the claim if it does turn out to have to be done in CH or DE? It may also say somewhere on Swiss website.Swiss has bad rep for just trying to ignore compo claims. Log claim by message/email or contact form on their website now while working out where is next step to go legal if they don’t agree to pay within 30 days (most likely they’ll ignore you and deny it’s their tactic). It will require persistence but there are reports of people getting paid.
Swiss uses a local arbitrator – SOP that you can use to escalate the complaint. All this assumes you were booked on one ticket/PNR from Berlin to Manchester. You could (if above applies) issue a claim via MCOL as it is a journey from EU (and Switzerland is included for EC261 purposes) to the UK but I would be a little wary as any UK entity against which you might issue a claim may just say they aren’t the operator and ask for the claim to be struck out.
Well – despite further emails arguing the case I have received exactly the same response from Swiss on every email received. So, I have now taken it to arbitration by a company called SOP – which I believe after googling is the most effective method of making them pay what is legally owed without taking them to court. Will update here if I make any progress. Thanks to folks that replied.
I contacted SOP as above and got an email this morning saying that Swiss had now acknowledged the claim and would be in touch, I really do recommend that process whenever dealing with the Lufthansa group. The annoying thing is that my case was a slam dunk, they had nowhere to hide yet still refused to even argue against it, instead they just spit out the standard EC261 does not apply…
It is obvious why they do this – I can imagine it saves them an absolute fortune given that many people would leave it after being ignored.
I recently started flying LH group as I am into Europe 2-3 times a month and live in the midlands, whereas before I was mainly US bound and travelled BA almost exclusively. I have to say I miss BA… maybe I just need to get status with LH to make the experience a little more seamless.
Have had a Business Class ticket from Tokyo-Papeete on Air Tahiti Nui in August 2023 cancelled. Booked via AA on AA miles.
Air Tahiti Nui says talk to AA, AA says can only rebook if rewards tickets available.
It seems that French Polynesia is included in EU261, and Air Tahiti Nui is a French airline, based in Tahiti. The aircraft are F-registered.
Reading EU261, it seems Article 8 obligations are on the operating carrier, not the ticketing one.
So how do I confirm all this? And where would I serve a court notice – ATN have a London office.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special_territories_of_members_of_the_European_Economic_Area#Summary_2
@Colin, I may be wrong but it’s possible that French Polynesia isn’t subject to EU law because it’s a French Overseas Territory rather than a “departement” (like Guadeloupe and Martinique). There’s a FT thread from a couple of years ago which might contain more info if you trawl through all the posts, though. I think France was refusing to honour EU261 at one point in the pandemic, has this been reversed now?@NorthernLass France can’t refuse EC261. That was for hotels you’re confusing. Hotels weren’t obliged to refund cash, but could offer a voucher or re-booking.
@Colin French Polynesia is included as part of EC261, but under general applicability of treaties as follows:« Under Article 355 of the TFEU, the provisions of the Treaties do apply to the French overseas departments, namely Guadeloupe, French Guiana, Martinique, Réunion Island, Mayotte as well as Saint-Martin, the Azores, Madeira and the Canary Islands. Therefore, as also stated in the Commission’s Interpretative Guidelines2, these territories are part of a Member State to which the Treaty applies within the meaning of the Regulation. »
However there is very little chance you are going to be able to enforce it Under EC261 you can only take it to court at the point of departure or arrival. I guess you could go to court in France or if they have some other procedures. I’d say it’s more likely you’ll need to do it in Papeete.
To add: Provided you paid with a UK credit card, I think you’d be better off enforcing this via S75 claim via your credit card provider (joint liability) for a replacement ticket. Research your cash options (like for like) and then contact to make S75 claim.
Have had a Business Class ticket from Tokyo-Papeete on Air Tahiti Nui in August 2023 cancelled. Booked via AA on AA miles.
Air Tahiti Nui says talk to AA, AA says can only rebook if rewards tickets available.
It seems that French Polynesia is included in EU261, and Air Tahiti Nui is a French airline, based in Tahiti. The aircraft are F-registered.
Reading EU261, it seems Article 8 obligations are on the operating carrier, not the ticketing one.
So how do I confirm all this? And where would I serve a court notice – ATN have a London office.
French Polynesia and New Caledonia are not part of the the EU. Article 355 of the TFEU referenced above also does not apply in those regions are they are not DOMs. Therefore unfortunately EC261 does not apply; even if it did, enforcement would be difficult, so not worth pursuing.
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