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hi all,
i have a finnair booking via amex travel and they just cancelled/amended my flight schedule.
The alternative itinerary is 12 hours earlier on the same day but that doesn’t quite work for me. Flight numbers are different, I’m not entirely sure if it counts as a change of schedule or cancellation + rerouting.I have asked amex travel to let me depart from a different airport but they declined and they said my only options are a full refund or accepting the earlier flight.
Can you guys please help clarify what my rights are exactly? Can I insist that they book me on a competitor’s flight (hoping that they’ll let me depart from a different airport) or are they allowed to change the timing by 12 hours and I just need to put up with it?
I’ve been reading the regulation but it’s all quite fuzzy, ‘earliest opportunity’ etc, if anybody can share some insight it’ll be much appreciated.
thanks a lot in advance
You have full UK/EU261 rights, that’s the easy part, getting them delivered is the hard part. It would help us advise you better if you share your itinerary but I’m guessing BKK, if so then it’s a cancellation not a schedule change.
yes its BRU to BKK via HEL in business class
i’m not entirely clear if they’ve satisfied their 261 obligations by offering the rerouting ‘at the earliest opportunity’ or if i can demand they stick to the original schedule if available (turkish have a flight very close to the original schedule)
yes its BRU to BKK via HEL in business class
i’m not entirely clear if they’ve satisfied their 261 obligations by offering the rerouting ‘at the earliest opportunity’ or if i can demand they stick to the original schedule if available (turkish have a flight very close to the original schedule)
I think you will find it very difficult to persuade Amex Travel to push Finnair to reroute you on Turkish flights and ‘demanding’ doesn’t mean getting. You might possibly have more chance of getting them to rebook you on alternative OW flights like QR. It makes it a lot harder doing this through a travel agent and in any event, rebooking you, for a long haul flight, 12 hours earlier might count as having discharged their EC261 liability.
Would moving to a day later be an option? You might (should?) be able to move the return later as well if that suits
no not really, i dont want to lose a full day.
Flight number change always makes it a cancellation. Even if the time is much closer to the orginal than in this case. This is why as soon as you get notice of a schedule change, you should compare old and new flght number. Cancellation gives you the highest set of rights which the airline must provide. So this may be why some airlines get confused and say it’s a reschedule when it’s a cancellation.
Theae rights are explained again and again in threads under the Flight Cancellations and Changes heading in the forum here. As well as the steps you will need to take to get whichever choice you make. Let’s just say right is on your side whatever you choose to do within reason. But as there is no punishment for blocking you,dragging it out and denying you, it probably will depend on your own resourefulness and resolve more than on the law, what you get as the law provides very good support.
No they can’t force you to take a refund (that’s a big part of their plan). They are desperate for you to take a refund as that way all your rights disappear and you may have to pay a lot more to get the travel again. Until you agree to takr a eefund,that’s actually what the airline must provide you with legally, at no extra cost over what you paid.. Those rights being your choice to choose refund or flying as close as reasonably possible to your original time, including on other carriers – and the CAA has pointed this out to airlines – or even to choose completely new dates to travel (within reason but that’s a wide choice). Your choice not the airline’s.
They will deny you and block and in the worst case you could end up buying your own replacement tickets, or at least reserving a flexible ticket. Or possibly collecting a wide range of replacement ticket quotes and being organised and persuasive in court submissions to have them provide the alernative flight you were enitled to. They also owe you meals and any extra accommodation costs during any extra wait or travel time.
It’s quite reasonable that someone would not be in a position to depart earlier. For one thing, we all have othet commitments. I would be wanting to leave at the same time, or perhaps a bit later than the original time but never earlier. Plus I believe airlines have started to adopt a system of trying to push passengers onto earlier flights evrn where later ones with seats exist, for a variety of reasons but possibly also hedging against any later further claims if there are further irrops on the travel that delay beyond your original arrival time at the end of the leg out or back. If they push you to earlier then this is less likely.
Please read up and follow advice here.
In all your commss make sure you keep detailed records.
PS if you paid by credit (not charge) card you may also be able to use Section 75, there are references to it on other threads within cancellations
PS if you paid by credit (not charge) card you may also be able to use Section 75, there are references to it on other threads within cancellations
The OP said it was booked via Amex Travel, so s75 won’t apply. Also, you mention making court submissions, but as this is under EC261, those submissions would need to be made in an EU court. UK261 does not apply. While saying the OP can drag it out, a) most of us want solutions and to be able to plan and b) Amex will not leave it undecided forever.
I am not sure about this agency rubbish JDB that people keep bringing up I think it’s a 3way claim and let the judge decide, that way you have the only potentially resppnsible parties im the room.
I am only thinking of EU261 not UK261. TBH I’m just waiting for the UK govt to unprotect consumers by castrating the UK version of 261 as soon as they feel fairly certain which of them will be im office after the next election.
I’m flaky on jurisdiction, but as a UK consumer who sitting in the UK was able to buy a product ‘made’in Europe then there must be a way of enforcing legal rights whether it’s UK ones at the point of sale via the travel agent and credit card protection or by using European statute for a product it covers ie EU261.
No I don’t want the OP to drag it out but warning him stonewalling and delay is a major tactic of the airlines.
I am not sure about this agency rubbish JDB that people keep bringing up I think it’s a 3way claim and let the judge decide, that way you have the only potentially resppnsible parties im the room.
I am only thinking of EU261 not UK261. TBH I’m just waiting for the UK govt to unprotect consumers by castrating the UK version of 261 as soon as they feel fairly certain which of them will be in office after the next election.
I’m flaky on jurisdiction, but as a UK consumer who sitting in the UK was able to buy a product ‘made’in Europe then there must be a way of enforcing legal rights whether it’s UK ones at the point of sale via the travel agent and credit card protection or by using European statute for a product it covers ie EU261.
No I don’t want the OP to drag it out but warning him stonewalling and delay is a major tactic of the airlines.
@Lady London re s75 this isn’t a matter of a three way claim. If you book via a travel agent the debtor supplier relationship is broken – it’s the same as paying via PayPal or Curve; there is nothing for a judge to decide. You can look this up very easily to confirm.
Re EC261, a UK court cannot consider matters of EU consumer law and as this journey is from EU countries to a third country and not on a UK airline, only EU protections apply. So, the pax can enforce EC261 but only in an EU court. This is an issue people need to be aware of in booking ex-EU flights.
just called back the agent, made the point quite strongly i’m prepared to litigate this, they said finnair are not the easiest to deal with… will see how it goes
just called back the agent, made the point quite strongly i’m prepared to litigate this, they said finnair are not the easiest to deal with… will see how it goes
Persuasion is your best bet here and if you are going to use an agent at all, better it is Amex than many others! You don’t want to be litigating if you can possibly avoid it.
to be honest i asked them to make the point that im prepared to litigate to finnair in the hope they’ll agree to my suggestion but im not sure i’d actually do it
they just agreed to my request so they’re reticketing me to depart from LHR, so threatening them with litigation worked! 😀
they just agreed to my request so they’re reticketing me to depart from LHR, so threatening them with litigation worked! 😀
Well done; great result. Negotiation and persuasion every time!
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