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https://www.webmd.com/sleep-disorders/ss/slideshow-sleep-positions
Side Position: Fetal
More than 40% of people sleep in this curled-up side-sleeping position. It’s the most common position for women — they’re twice as likely as men to sleep like this. Some research suggests you may be more likely to be warm, friendly, and sensitive, but you also may have a protective shell around you.@supergers49 as is your right. But it’s interesting that you object more to potential hyperbole than to the use of gender stereotypes.
I think this is 2022’s entry for Rob’s annual TIFU comment.
Last years was the one about you’d be mad to work in the public sector instead of banking (or words to that effect).I don’t think Rob sets out to be deliberately offensive, so some of the outrage is a bit over the top.
However, I do feel he is influenced by what he feels this sites target audience is meant to be.I’m with @rach on this.
HfP has long had tone issues, and if you fall outside of the white/weathly/male/london based target audience it won’t take too long to realise this.
I never understand how people think it’s fine to tell someone what they can and can’t put on their own website. Calling out a few middle-aged blokes for sexism will do nothing whatsoever to help women in places where sexism is a very dangerous and present threat, like Afghanistan or Mexico. I wonder how many people who complain here are also lobbying those governments and ones in similar countries to improve the lot of their female population who can only dream of having the rights that women in Europe take for granted. How many keyboard warriors actually sponsor a girl in a developing country, or teach girls who have missed education due to lockdown for nothing, or any other practical measure which would really make a difference?
I too found the comment unnecessary but Sexism is, in my view, extremely harsh. It isn’t inclusive language. Calling it Sexism in my view degrades the severity that others experience on a daily basis or countries where Women aren’t allowed to work. Phrasing and terminology is a dark art.
(Yes I have said “dark art” for a reason. It fundamentally stems from dark / black = bad or mysterious, white / light is good or nice. It’s not racist, it is far from inclusive language though). For those that are new: I am a young, white, disabled, well off but not wealthy person. I also do a lot of work on Diversity and Inclusion 🙂
So when is it sexism? What’s the threshold?
And if I do all the things on @northernlass’s list, am I OK to call out middle aged men?
I’m not saying it’s the worst thing to happen. But I would be really interested to know how you arrive at your classification of what is and isn’t sexism and within that classification which things we need to tackle first. Because by the reasoning here we’re not meant to tackle any minor issues while some people are facing bigger problems.
I have also done a huge amount of work, academically and professionally, on diversity and inclusion, on power structures and discrimination, and on the drivers of change of social attitudes. Tackling the things some people think are small makes much more difference than many people think.
You only need to look at the speed with which several commenters without any knowledge of the subject matter dismissed and denigrated the objections of those who pointed out that the article contained a generalisation to see that people are incredibly unwilling to accept the suggestion that their (privileged) world view isn’t the single version of the truth.
the article contained a generalisation
This is the correct term to describe Rob’s words.
Nothing stronger as you need to look at context.- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
Yes. And what type of generalisation was it?
So when is it sexism? What’s the threshold?
And if I do all the things on @northernlass’s list, am I OK to call out middle aged men?
Please don’t generalise about middle aged men, not everybody with a penis born before 1990 is a misogynistic dinosaur.
“To generalise is to be an idiot”
William BlakeIf you read the comments carefully @roberto, instead of trying to get one up on someone whose opinion you don’t care about, you’ll realise I’m sure that I made no generalisations about middle aged men and only mentioned them in response to someone else’s comment about “calling out.”
People really are offended by anything these days.
when I read the original article I thought it might stir a few comments but I was more concerned that Rob didnt know a USB B from USB A ie a factual error
Oh FGS, when I read it this morning I just knew, such is the world these days, that someone would start bleating and waving their ‘I’m offended’ banner. Please have a day off. It must be so utterly exhausting being offended constantly. I think you must the same Rach(el) who got offended over something similar in the chat thread a few months ago. Just lighten up. The comment was NOT sexist. Newsflash….there *are* differences between males and females and the way we think, sit, act etc. It’s not a bad thing. One isn’t more valid than the other. Nothing Rob said was remotely offensive, just an observation. A correct one at that. You are allowed to remark on some differences between genders. It’s not a freaking hate crime!
I’m a massively proud feminist. Pick your battles more wisely. There’s rife casual (and overt) sexism out there that really needs addressing. This isn’t it! Generalisations exist for a reason. It’s not always a negative. Anyone who thinks they are immune to indulging in it is a cretin.- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
I don’t think anyone is offended. I’m certainly not. But I don’t have to be personally offended by something to think it’s less than ideal or to comment on it and say so.
I haven’t assumed that you’re offended by this thread just because you’ve commented.
- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
@amyc a massively proud feminist who tells another person you assume to be a woman what they should and shouldn’t be focusing and commenting on. Hmmm
So when is it sexism? What’s the threshold?
And if I do all the things on @northernlass’s list, am I OK to call out middle aged men?
I’m not saying it’s the worst thing to happen. But I would be really interested to know how you arrive at your classification of what is and isn’t sexism and within that classification which things we need to tackle first. Because by the reasoning here we’re not meant to tackle any minor issues while some people are facing bigger problems.
I have also done a huge amount of work, academically and professionally, on diversity and inclusion, on power structures and discrimination, and on the drivers of change of social attitudes. Tackling the things some people think are small makes much more difference than many people think.
You only need to look at the speed with which several commenters without any knowledge of the subject matter dismissed and denigrated the objections of those who pointed out that the article contained a generalisation to see that people are incredibly unwilling to accept the suggestion that their (privileged) world view isn’t the single version of the truth.
It’s about the context, the intent and the impact. It is sometimes a very fine line. In my view the act of saying that part of the article does have sexist undertones but it is not overt sexism. Also, I am not trying to say this doesn’t need addressing, it absolutely does, over time. But overt sexism is a much higher priority, at least in my view.
Also can everyone on both sides of this debate please stop with the generalizations. It not helpful and not conductive to your point. And the general bitterness, respect opinions and differences. Don’t resort to derogatory terms
- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
I don’t think anyone is offended. I’m certainly not. But I don’t have to be personally offended by something to think it’s less than ideal or to comment on it and say so.
I haven’t assumed that you’re offended by this thread just because you’ve commented.
I’m so pleased for you. When you get a day off from being a sanctimonious bore and pointing out everything and anything that’s ‘Less than ideal’ (in your opinion) do let me know. FYI, being a feminist does not preclude me from telling anyone, male or female when they are being an insufferable plank. I’ll (insincerely) apologise in advance now for daring to suggest there are two genders. I’m sure you’ll be bursting to re-educate me on that. 🙄
@amyc and there you go again with your assumptions. You seem much more agitated about this than I am.
When you get a day off from arguing with people you consider to be sanctimonious bores, perhaps you could educate yourself about a few things and take some anger management classes.
And the insults really do nothing to support your point of view or make you look cool in front of your friends.
Massive kudos to whoever had the genius to put this in the Housekeeping forum and blithely not remark on that. And here I thought the Finnair review would spark a debate about sockless feet on seats.
@amyc and there you go again with your assumptions. You seem much more agitated about this than I am.
When you get a day off from arguing with people you consider to be sanctimonious bores, perhaps you could educate yourself about a few things and take some anger management classes.
And the insults really do nothing to support your point of view or make you look cool in front of your friends.
Cool? I’ve never been cool or strived to be. I also don’t have friends on here. Nice try in belittling me but you are an intelligent person and could have done better. If anyone is trying to be cool I would think it’s the virtue signaller, that’s very on trend at the moment.
If you think my reaction is ‘Angry’ then I assume you rarely venture from your ‘safe space’ and that is a wise strategy. God only knows how you’d cope in the big wide world.- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
Don’t worry about how I’m coping in the world. It’s not me who resorts without provocation to insulting strangers on the internet.
Please have a lovely day. And when I get a moment I’ll send you some useful material to help with the anger issues.
I’m white, wealthy, and male and only have an issue with the London-centric nature of this blog. Yet historically I’ve been willing to tolerate Rob’s tone deaf opinions based upon what it is like to live in London.
I’m been inspired to be more reactionary now. Rob you should be ashamed for not understanding the trauma of taking a connecting flight.
Thank you Rach.
I was genuinely interested in Finnair’s new seats given they have regional connections. However I felt alienated by the original article as it showed a person who looked like they identified as a female in a number of seating positions I felt would be unsuitable for me.
I now realise that there should have been nine seating positions that would have worked for me featuring someone I could relate to.
Again, thank you Rach.
Peace.
PS Amy – I’ll be your friend.
Don’t worry about how I’m coping in the world. It’s not me who resorts without provocation to insulting strangers on the internet.
Please have a lovely day. And when I get a moment I’ll send you some useful material to help with the anger issues.
I’ll wager you’re more agitated than me given you started a thread and countered everyone who disagreed.
“Insufferable bore”. Not much of an insult really now is it?
“Insulting strangers on the internet?” Strangers? I thought you lot were my friends? Always willing to repeat what has been said in person if you’re ever in the vicinity.
Do send me some patronising guff when you get that moment you speak of.
Genuinely wishing you a pleasant rest of day. I vehemently disagree with you on this but hold no grudges and wish you well.
Froggee…..Thank you, that’s kind. I accept.- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
People really are offended by anything these days.
NO WE’RE NOT, HOW DARE YOU!!
;o)
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