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Hello all
I am still a newbie to Avios and 241s etc and today I saw one of Rob’s articles say that you should get at least 0.8p per Avios when dedeeming or else it is a waste. Can anybody help me out with the maths on my recent redemption to see if it flies… Please!Two flights to St Lucia 150000 Avios and about £1100 in taxes for two people. Current cash price for those exact same flights on same days is £13,795.06 (utterly mad than anybody would pay this imo).
Interested to see how this one works out.
Thanks.
The actual cash price is irrelevant if you wouldn’t have paid it. But if you look at it as either £2300 (150k x 0.8p + £1100) to spend in Sainsbury or 2 x return flights to St Lucia in CW then I know which option I think is best!!
If I recall by Rob’s post, if you wouldn’t pay the £13k then that isn’t a correct reference point. It sounds like you have already made the redemption, so you are just looking to discuss this or would cancel if the maths does not work out?
I assume these are business flights, what are the premium and economy prices? If it were me, I would use those prices (assuming I would be willing to pay them) to work out the pence per avios if it falls short of 0.8, consider it as the price of an upgrade.
Reney’s approach is how I tend to think of things as well.
Work out what I would be willing to pay in cash (either for biz or PE), look at the total cost of the cash + avios ticket (I tend to use 1p per avios) and compare the two.
Worth remembering that avios flights can be refunded, whereas lower price cash tickets cannot, so you need to decide how much you value that flexibility as well.
Yep just interested. Have already booked and have zero plans to change as this gets me out of the country next Christmas which is a dream! For me flight redemption will always beat Nectar and Sainsburys redemption because it is (in most cases) the only way I can justify business class travel.
Premium economy for those flights is £4101.06
Economy is £3037.06Is there a simple formula that works this out?
Prices fluctuate a lot so it’s very difficult to truly ascertain the value you’ve got from your avios. Because of the large amount of taxes/fees you have to stump up on top, I consider avios as a hefty discount on whatever the cash price would be.
Yep just interested. Have already booked and have zero plans to change as this gets me out of the country next Christmas which is a dream! For me flight redemption will always beat Nectar and Sainsburys redemption because it is (in most cases) the only way I can justify business class travel.
Premium economy for those flights is £4101.06
Economy is £3037.06Is there a simple formula that works this out?
(Price that you would have paid minus taxes you paid) divided by the avios paid = pence per avios.
150000 avios x 0.8p = £1200 + £1100 = £2300. If you’d pay that then it’s a neutral deal.
If you’d pay less than £2300, or BA is selling the flights for less than that, it’s a bad deal.
The more you’d pay the better the deal gets for you, and it’s irrelevant what BA is selling the flights for except for bragging purposes.
Plus or minus a bit for no avios and TPs earned on a redemption, and no credit card avios / spend bonuses on the £1200 equivalent of avios.
I think this is pretty much a no-brainer in terms of amazing redemptions.
You might find this Earn or Burn calculator useful if you are still undecided: Earn or Burn Calculator
Yep just interested. Have already booked and have zero plans to change as this gets me out of the country next Christmas which is a dream! For me flight redemption will always beat Nectar and Sainsburys redemption because it is (in most cases) the only way I can justify business class travel.
Premium economy for those flights is £4101.06
Economy is £3037.06Is there a simple formula that works this out?
“zero plans to change as this gets me out of the country” You really answer your own question here. You can value a redemption two ways, davefl method which is fine and gives you a penny value answer, or was it worth it for you value. If you’re someone that would never drop £2K+ on a business class ticket, but like to travel that way then it’s an entirely subjective value.
Others feels differently, but another factor to consider, particular in the context of the last couple of years is the flexibility of an Avios ticket, comparing it to a discounted non-refundable £1500 business fare is not like for like.
There are two separate questions here. Q1 is, “How much did my Reward flight cost me?”, and Q2 is, “If I have a choice, should I book a cash flight or a reward flight.”
Q1 is easy. Avios are a fungible asset, as they can be exchanged for a near-infinite range of consumer goods from Sainsbury’s, ebay or Argos at 0.8p. Ignoring the value or cost of tier points, 2-4-1 vouchers and ticket flexibility, the correct answer is that my reward flight cost me the cash surcharge + Avios spend x 0.008. If the answer is more than you would have been willing to pay in cash, you are being emotional rather than rational if you choose to travel.
Q2 is a little more tricky as cash flights earn Avios. If you have the choice of an acceptably priced cash ticket or a reward flight, you first need to work out the cost per avios as (cash cost of cash flight minus cash cost of reward flight) / (Avios cost of reward flight minus Avios earned on cash flight). Once you have the cost per Avios, you can choose. if it is less than 0.8p, you should buy the cash ticket and spend the Avios in Sainsbury’s. If it is more than 0.8p, you should spend the Avios unless you have a fairly clear view on an alternative use for them where they would earn more than the value you have calculated.
- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
Cash prices are silly as you are booking 12 months out. They only offer high prices initially as apparently the ones booking that far out are those who have to so, or are a captive audience.
(£cash cost of flight – £fees for redemption)/ number of Avios used = £/avios
£/avios x100 = pence/avios
Another way of thinking about it is to take the economy price (assuming you would have paid that) and then think about what cash upgrade offer would have tempted you. £250 each way? £500 each way?
For Seychelles I’d personally use £1750 return as a ‘fair’ price. I could probably get a cash ticket for that if I was willing to start in Europe or travel indirect, and whilst a cash ticket isn’t refundable I’d also be earning miles back. That said, with my wife and kids I am usurprisingly not keen to start in Europe or do a change if I can help it, so I am probably undervaluing what I would realistically pay.
£1750 – £550 taxes = £1200 so, if you have no 241, you’re getting exactly 0.8p based on 150k or 1.6p with a 241.
In the current climate the fact that redemptions are refundable is all important for me. The only things that might make me book a non-refundable fare are:
– business travel on someone else’s money (ie their risk)
– really need the TPs to nudge me over a status boundaryNon-refundable tickets are often drastically cheaper than their full- / semi- flex counterparts. It’s the latter I’d compare with.
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