Here’s how the airlines want to resolve the 80/20 slot rule for the Winter

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• ChrisC says:

  7 Sep7 September 05:47

  If BA have sacked / out in a pool / transferred to LHR it’s LGW short haul pilots then why is it still selling short haul flights from Gatwick?

  • Kevin says:

    7 Sep7 September 07:30

    Have I stumbled into a Unite update? They haven’t been sacked. They have been made redundant. No point using incorrect terms.

    • ChrisC says:

      7 Sep7 September 08:03

      Hope you are also complaing about Rob then because he used the word ‘fired’

      • Pablo says:

        7 Sep7 September 08:09

        Are Gatwick cancellations a safe bet? I’m thinking of booking a cheap flight from Gatwick to Vienna for November and when BA cancel, rebook for Christmas time out of Heathrow. Would BA let me rebook that far out or would they insist that I rebook onto a LHR departure within a couple of days of original November date?

        • Lady London says:

          7 Sep7 September 08:28

          Do it quick. At the first sign this is going through BA will ‘mop up’ and cancel everything else out of LGW

          Other airlines have already cancelled much of oct and they will follow closely with same to at least mid-Dec

        • marcw says:

          7 Sep7 September 08:47

          Iberia has already cut 75% production until march ’21.
          I still think it’s still too optimistic though.

        • Alex Sm says:

          7 Sep7 September 13:35

          What do they “produce”?

        • Rob says:

          7 Sep7 September 09:06

          If BA cancels an Avios ticket you can rebook for any day, irrespective of availability, as long as it is within 355 days of the day you paid the tax on the original. That’s why many readers are off to the Caribbean and Maldives for Christmas 🙂

          You can’t do this on cash bookings.

        • Robert de Mornay Davies says:

          7 Sep7 September 09:37

          Is that the case if you accepted a future travel voucher in April when it was pretty much impossible to get a refund

        • pauldb says:

          7 Sep7 September 09:40

          Why not for cash tickets: rebooking within ticket validity In the lowest booking class available is in the COVID rebooking guidelines for all tickets.

          Obviously booking a cheap cash ticket in hope of a cancellation is riskier.

        • Rh says:

          7 Sep7 September 10:24

          Hi Rob, does it have to be the same route or can you choose somewhere else?

        • Rob says:

          7 Sep7 September 11:36

          You get, I think, 300 miles of leeway. Only really helps in a handful of cities.

        • Rh says:

          7 Sep7 September 16:12

          Thanks Rob.

        • Alex Sm says:

          7 Sep7 September 13:36

          Assuming only if there are seats available

        • Jonathan says:

          7 Sep7 September 14:06

          Debatable. You’re entitled to a reroute/reschedule but BA may insist on a narrow window in which case you’d be looking at small claims/arbitration. I wouldn’t want to rely on a district judge or arbitrator playing along with your game as it’s fairly obvious your after a free “upgrade”.

          It’s a bit different if there are no BA flights from London to your destination in which case you’re forced to substantially shift dates.

  • JohnT says:

    7 Sep7 September 07:41

    Exactly! Have a ski flight (to Austria? got to hope) in Jan. Wonder when they will admit and start cancelling?

• Tim says:

  7 Sep7 September 06:32

  The EU will take the course favoured by Lufthansa and Air France. I’d put money on it.

  • Planeconcorde says:

    7 Sep7 September 07:32

    +1

  • marcw says:

    7 Sep7 September 08:52

    The EC will take course what’s best. It’s obvious we need another slot waiver.

    • Andrew says:

      7 Sep7 September 09:36

      Why do you think it’s obvious? What would happen if a waiver wasn’t allowed? No airline (with the exception of maybe Wizz) has the money to run massive amounts of near empty flights. BA and other large European airlines would lose some of their slots but it’s not as if others are queuing up to take them. If they were then BA would be leasing the slots right now to bring in a bit of cash. When things pick up BA would snap up the available slots again. Yeah they wouldn’t get them all back but they’d probably get the majority since money-wise they’re still more healthy than most and they’ve got the connecting market to feed in to long haul routes.

      • marcw says:

        7 Sep7 September 09:59

        You aware you need a slot at both airports? Major airports in Europe are slot regulated. If there is no waiver, the consequences start at the NW21 season.

        • Andrew says:

          7 Sep7 September 10:59

          I am aware. It doesn’t change what I think would ultimately happen. Maybe you could enlighten me as to how it would turn out to be a disaster (for the consumer)?

        • marcw says:

          7 Sep7 September 11:25

          50% of (free) available capacity must be made available to new airlines.

        • Andrew says:

          7 Sep7 September 11:42

          “Made available”. If the demand isn’t there then incumbants can take it up. I can’t see many new entrants queuing up at the moment to get into the market and if they were that would be a good thing surely? BA are often criticised here for being able to rest on their laurels due to the lack in competition out of Heathrow.

        • Lady London says:

          7 Sep7 September 16:46

          Wizz and Ryanair would be in to the major European money-making airports, Munich in particular, like a rat up a drainpipe if unused slots get put up to bidders.

          Who seriously thinks the German governmnet will left Lufthansa leave any chink of light open in Munich to those airlines ??!!

• Bob says:

  7 Sep7 September 07:03

  Will be good news for the wet leasers -can see airlines flying one service a week next winter to demonstrate they are maintaining a presence as promised this winter… Not dissimilar to “Parliamentary” rail services where one service is kept in the timetable as it’s easier than going through the formal closure process for a stretch of track otherwise not required.

  • Charlieface says:

    7 Sep7 September 11:02

    Has to be 80% usage. I wish Parliamentary were anywhere near as strict

    • Rob says:

      7 Sep7 September 11:35

      This is in regard to airlines which have ‘left’ airports not getting a waiver.

      • Charlieface says:

        7 Sep7 September 14:01

        As in they get a waiver if they demonstrate usage. I see what you mean.

        The point about Parliamentaries still stands 🙂

• Willie says:

  7 Sep7 September 07:05

  Whatever Lufthansa wants it will get. The EU is the most restrictive trade body in the world and this proposal will be nodded through.

  • Ken says:

    7 Sep7 September 07:15

    Here we go.
    Plucky old Britain against all those nasty furriners.

  • J says:

    7 Sep7 September 07:52

    Alitalia is state owned. I believe Finnair is majority state owned too. AF/KLM is majority private but as with Lufthansa they’re very looked after by their govts. And given how protected BA are at Heathrow the same is true in the UK. BA aren’t facing serious competition at Heathrow anytime soon (or ever). Competition would be easyJet or another LCC having a decent chunk of slots at Heathrow.

• Doc says:

  7 Sep7 September 07:18

  Usual story. Big bullies trying to get what they want and usually do. Let’s see what happens since as per my comment when this story broke out, there is no way the Germans are going to let other airlines into the Lufthansa stronghold at Frankfurt and Munich. Alitalia is pretty much financed by the Italian government, Iberia holds 80% of Spanish market but am unsure on how AF/KLM will be helped. Interesting times.

• PeterK says:

  7 Sep7 September 07:43

  BA will want this proposed waiver just as much as any other European carrier given its LHR operation is a shadow of last year.

  • Peter K says:

    7 Sep7 September 11:05

    Not the usual Peter K. I still miss gravitars or at least another way to differentiate the regular posters.

• Opus says:

  7 Sep7 September 08:37

  I believe the EU will grant the waiver. It makes sense really. You can’t dish out all that money to your airlines and not do everything you can to protect that investment.

  • Doug says:

    7 Sep7 September 08:58

    Exactly. What logic in the gov aid to LH, AF and KL if you then wreck their position through slot loss. Airlines far from out the wood yet, makes little sense to force competition in current situation.

• L Allen says:

  7 Sep7 September 08:53

  Just booked flights to Tirana in March next year, in the sale. Allegedly going from LGW. Will be very happy if they are moved to LHR!

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