Dilemma – BAPP £30k Avios signup bonus triggered twice

[bjd]

So bit of story behind this one….when I signed up for the BAPP there was an temporary error on the Amex website saying the £30k Avios SUB was after 3k spend (it should of course be 6k), I queried it with them and they said they would honour it, but that id need to call for them to trigger the bonus manually. So after the 3k spend I called and they were good to their word. However….. when I recently hit the spend of £6k, guess what happened….another 30k dropped.

It seems that whoever manually triggered the points at 3k didn’t turn off the automation for the 6k spend. Or something like that.
Ironically I only noticed when the 60k hit my BAEC account last week. And thats the further complication – they are not even in my Amex account anymore. Not sure how relevant it is, but im still 7k off hitting the 241 threshold.

What do I do here lol. Or more to the point….what would you do here?!!

[NorthernLass]

Spend another £3k and see what happens 🤷‍♀️

[bjd]

NorthernLass wrote:

Spend another £3k and see what happens 🤷‍♀️

hadnt thought of that 🙂

[mikey0]

Honesty being the best policy, I would either phone and discuss the issue. Likelihood is they’ll tell you to keep them to reward your honesty lol or write to them at Brighton to keep yourself right. That way they can’t come back to you in the future. On the three occasions I’ve written to them, they’ve never answered.

[bjd]

mikey0 wrote:

Honesty being the best policy, I would either phone and discuss the issue. Likelihood is they’ll tell you to keep them to reward your honesty lol or write to them at Brighton to keep yourself right. That way they can’t come back to you in the future. On the three occasions I’ve written to them, they’ve never answered.

This is the side im heading towards to be honest. Its a mix up, these things happen, and what we don’t want to do is cause any complications moving forward (ive been an on/off customer for 10+ years) and I certainly don’t want to compromise the 241 either.

Im very aware that once I contact Brighton, their radar is on and theres no turning back…but as you say if in doubt, honesty is the policy. Im intrigued that you hand wrote to them btw.

[Swiss Jim]

Bet you’re wishing you’d never noticed this. On reflection you may realise you haven’t…. 🤔

[Scott]

Do you want to keep the unearned points?

If so, but you want to keep yourself right at the same time, message them through live chat. The chat agents are not, in the main, very clued up, and I’d be confident I could ‘confess’ to something like this without them really understanding the issue and so little chance of them insisting they will have to claw them back.

[bjd]

So update. My conscience correctly got the best of me and I phoned Amex and talked it through with them. Apparently a case has been raised to claw back the 30k Avios points from BA (is this even possible?)

I said that’s ok and fair, but what I didn’t want to happen if that wasn’t possible, was that my BAPP Amex account go into 30k Avios arrears, off the back of a mistake by someone in Brighton and no fault of my own.

I’m not convinced the person I spoke to knew what they were raising a case for exactly but at least it’s out in the open and what will be will be.

Honesty always the best policy. Let’s wait and see.

[HampshireHog]

bjd wrote:

So update. My conscience correctly got the best of me and I phoned Amex and talked it through with them. Apparently a case has been raised to claw back the 30k Avios points from BA (is this even possible?)

I said that’s ok and fair, but what I didn’t want to happen if that wasn’t possible, was that my BAPP Amex account go into 30k Avios arrears, off the back of a mistake by someone in Brighton and no fault of my own.

I’m not convinced the person I spoke to knew what they were raising a case for exactly but at least it’s out in the open and what will be will be.

Honesty always the best policy. Let’s wait and see.

Oh dear, I fear you may wish you’d let sleeping dogs lie

[bjd]

HampshireHog wrote:

bjd wrote:

So update. My conscience correctly got the best of me and I phoned Amex and talked it through with them. Apparently a case has been raised to claw back the 30k Avios points from BA (is this even possible?)

I said that’s ok and fair, but what I didn’t want to happen if that wasn’t possible, was that my BAPP Amex account go into 30k Avios arrears, off the back of a mistake by someone in Brighton and no fault of my own.

I’m not convinced the person I spoke to knew what they were raising a case for exactly but at least it’s out in the open and what will be will be.

Honesty always the best policy. Let’s wait and see.

Oh dear, I fear you may wish you’d let sleeping dogs lie

Not really. I’d rather it was out in the open. As long as it doesn’t cause me any headaches with Amex moving forward. We’ll have to see how it plays out in that respect.

I’d feel guilty getting 30k Avios that I didn’t earn and wasn’t entitled to because of someone’s mistake.

[Harrods]

Well done, now you’ve gone into arrears on your Avios account on AMEX side and will need to spend £20k to get the 30k Avios back. Worst case, they would’ve clawed back the Avios themselves at the later point, instead you’ve essentially asked them to do it now. Seems like the 30k arrears will be the cause of the headache now.

You’ve saved American Express, a company with a $200bn market cap a couple of pennies.

[bjd]

Harrods wrote:

Well done, now you’ve gone into arrears on your Avios account on AMEX side and will need to spend £20k to get the 30k Avios back. Worst case, they would’ve clawed back the Avios themselves at the later point, instead you’ve essentially asked them to do it now. Seems like the 30k arrears will be the cause of the headache now.

You’ve saved American Express, is a company with a $200bn market cap a couple of pennies.

Not sure if you read what I said.

The extra 30k Avios were never mine in the first place so it’s not a case of getting them ‘back’.

I have asked Amex to raise a case to pull back the Avios from my BAEC. I’ve not gone into any arrears.

And If I do end up in 30k arrears, I will query it with them, as I am essentially being penalised for their error. Worse case I will close my account when I hit the 241 voucher spend threshold (£6k to go). But I hope it doesn’t come to that.

Either way my conscience will be clear. I don’t want points I didn’t earn, especially when they are earned by someone’s mistake.

[JDB]

Harrods wrote:

Well done, now you’ve gone into arrears on your Avios account on AMEX side and will need to spend £20k to get the 30k Avios back. Worst case, they would’ve clawed back the Avios themselves at the later point, instead you’ve essentially asked them to do it now. Seems like the 30k arrears will be the cause of the headache now.

You’ve saved American Express, a company with a $200bn market cap a couple of pennies.

It’s quite astonishing to criticise someone for being honest (and even worse on Christmas Day if you listened to any sermon) and the size of the ‘victim’ company is beyond irrelevant. One is either honest and straightforward or expedient.

@Harrods – if you ran a business, presumably you wouldn’t mind if a customer took you for a ride.

Well done and a very Happy Christmas and New Year to @BJD. Most right thinking people would only wish to employ or have someone with that esprit as a partner or parent/child.

[bjd]

JDB wrote:

Harrods wrote:

Well done, now you’ve gone into arrears on your Avios account on AMEX side and will need to spend £20k to get the 30k Avios back. Worst case, they would’ve clawed back the Avios themselves at the later point, instead you’ve essentially asked them to do it now. Seems like the 30k arrears will be the cause of the headache now.

You’ve saved American Express, a company with a $200bn market cap a couple of pennies.

It’s quite astonishing to criticise someone for being honest (and even worse on Christmas Day if you listened to any sermon) and the size of the ‘victim’ company is beyond irrelevant. One is either honest and straightforward or expedient.

@Harrods – if you ran a business, presumably you wouldn’t mind if a customer took you for a ride.

Well done and a very Happy Christmas and New Year to @BJD. Most right thinking people would only wish to employ or have someone with that esprit as a partner or parent/child.

Thank you. And Happy Christmas to you and yours as well.

[JDB]

Outstanding pomposity with the usual side of condescending superiority from JDB; this is how he displays goodwill to all on Christmas Day. Top work, well done Sir.

Thank you for your kind and thoughtful words and confirming which team you are on. Academic research suggests around 20-25% of the population is dishonest. I’m happy to speak up for the quiet majority that tries to do the right thing every day and doesn’t create entirely false narratives along the lines that when it’s a large corporation, the government or a rich person, all moral standards can be forgotten. Where does that lead/end?

[pbcold]

I shall overlook the ludicrously illogical conclusion that you have jumped to regarding my honesty as the usual social media nonsense that people resort to when feeling defensive. If you are able to read my post with an objective eye you will see that I did not question what you said. It is the manner in which you speak to others that is open to question as your post this morning so concisely confirms.

[JDB]

@pbcold – I haven’t opined or jumped to any conclusions about your honesty! I only juxtaposed my comments about your post with the research. You have now had two opportunities to say whether the OP was right to be honest or whether you supported others who say he was stupid to be honest.

Your criticisms of me would have carried considerably more weight if prefaced either with saying you agreed but hated what I said or I was wrong on both counts. The thread is about 30k points given in error, not about me. Please let us know.

[pbcold]

I have no interest in the discussion; I have erroneously attempted to try and teach you some manners. Those who did so at school years ago manifestly failed in their attempts and it seems that I, too, am making no progress.

[The Savage Squirrel]

My position in all situations like this is to send one concise but clear Email describing the issue to the relevant CS. This gives the company the opportunity to sort it out, allows my conscience to be clear and gives a ‘paper’ trail should my integrity be questioned down the line. If the company fails to take action, or says they will sort out the issue but then doesn’t (a very common outcome), then that is 100% not my problem and I enjoy the good outcome guilt free.

[pbcold]

An eminently sensible approach, expressed with civility. How delightful.

[Bill_B]

pbcold wrote:

I have no interest in the discussion; I have erroneously attempted to try and teach you some manners. Those who did so at school years ago manifestly failed in their attempts and it seems that I, too, am making no progress.

Ironically JDB’s original post didn’t contain any personal attacks at all, while you used it as an opportunity to attack his character without participating in the discussion at all.

To me, arguing in good faith and avoiding unpleasantries means attacking the argument, not the person. In this case the relevant question to be addressed is to whether anything is “owed” to large organisations like Amex.

[Scott]

There’s a great-looking recipe in today’s Guardian for Bombay chilli cheese ciabatta, but does anyone know where I could buy “chaat masala” ?

[TGLoyalty]

Do Nothing.

[R76]

bjd wrote:

So update. My conscience correctly got the best of me and I phoned Amex and talked it through with them. Apparently a case has been raised to claw back the 30k Avios points from BA (is this even possible?)

I said that’s ok and fair, but what I didn’t want to happen if that wasn’t possible, was that my BAPP Amex account go into 30k Avios arrears, off the back of a mistake by someone in Brighton and no fault of my own.

As a matter of interest, why do you say the “arrears” solution is a bad one? If I’ve understood it right, it would simply mean that you’ve had the 30K Avios credited to your BA account earlier than they should have been – before you’ve earned them, rather than afterwards. It looks from a later comment like you plan/hope to keep the card in the long term, so eventually you’ll earn the points fair and square and everything will balance out.

I’m a member of a cashback scheme which quite regularly pays out prematurely for hotel stays, and then claws it back if my plans change and I cancel the booking – which leaves me with a negative balance to work off. It’s a minor irritant, because while I’m “paying off” the “debt” I’m not getting the dopamine hit of seeing cashback appear in my bank account, but logically speaking all that’s happened is I’ve got the money earlier than I should have done.

(NB. I don’t need anyone to explain to me how I could exploit this situation. I choose not to.)

[bjd]

R76 wrote:

bjd wrote:

So update. My conscience correctly got the best of me and I phoned Amex and talked it through with them. Apparently a case has been raised to claw back the 30k Avios points from BA (is this even possible?)

I said that’s ok and fair, but what I didn’t want to happen if that wasn’t possible, was that my BAPP Amex account go into 30k Avios arrears, off the back of a mistake by someone in Brighton and no fault of my own.

As a matter of interest, why do you say the “arrears” solution is a bad one? If I’ve understood it right, it would simply mean that you’ve had the 30K Avios credited to your BA account earlier than they should have been – before you’ve earned them, rather than afterwards. It looks from a later comment like you plan/hope to keep the card in the long term, so eventually you’ll earn the points fair and square and everything will balance out.

I’m a member of a cashback scheme which quite regularly pays out prematurely for hotel stays, and then claws it back if my plans change and I cancel the booking – which leaves me with a negative balance to work off. It’s a minor irritant, because while I’m “paying off” the “debt” I’m not getting the dopamine hit of seeing cashback appear in my bank account, but logically speaking all that’s happened is I’ve got the money earlier than I should have done.

(NB. I don’t need anyone to explain to me how I could exploit this situation. I choose not to.)

I certainly see where you are coming from, but my plan was never to keep the card long term.

As far as I’m concerned the extra 30k have not been credited earlier than they should’ve have been, because they should not have been credited at all. It’s an admin error.

Once I hit the 241 threshold I was going to close the account and restart the 2 year cycle. I was never likely to take the spend any higher post 241 trigger and absolutley wouldn’t have expected to earn another 30k Avios.

Obviously so much of this is moot at the moment, but if the scenario occurs that they do put me 30k in arrears then I won’t be earning anymore Avios until I clear the balance which is what… an extra £20k spend? Well, I won’t be doing that.
Once I hit the 241, I’ll end up cancelling my account which will have something like a -24k Avios deficit. No idea how it works but there’s always the chance this could affect any future applications.

I didn’t ask for any of this lol…I’ve just tried to be honest about the whole thing.

The simplest solution would be for them to pull the Avios back from my BAEC but I don’t know if that’s possible or not.