British Airways improves short haul snacks in Economy, and makes lounge loos unisex

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• Alan says:

  2 Aug2 August 07:39

  At least with pretzels they couldn’t go wrong and they were very tasty. I suspect these cakes will be synthetic rubbish and as you say the flavour choices are a bit weird. Sounds like a downgrade (aka enhancement) to me.

• Ian says:

  2 Aug2 August 07:48

  The loos at T5 Galleries South Club lounge have been unisex for a while now.

• supergers49 says:

  2 Aug2 August 07:51

  The problem with having individual cubicles and not urinals is that most men then treat the toilet as a urinal, with all the accuracy of a Chris Waddle penalty.

  • jj says:

    2 Aug2 August 08:13

    Exactly this. I’m willing to bet that every person who has posted an approving comment about unisex loos is male.

    There are basic physiological differences between men and women which mean men’s toilets will always be messier than women’s. That doesn’t matter for most blokes, as humans poo much more frequently than they were, so guys rarely have to sit on a toilet seat out of the house. Culturally, the proportion of men who tolerate filth and refuse to clean up after making a.mess seems to be much higher, too. A quick glance around the loos in student accommodation will support that idea.

    Shared toilets mean that women will often have to sit on urine-soaked seats whilst making sure that no item of clothing brushes against a urine-soaked floor. It’s utterly disgusting and a sign of contempt for 50% of the population

    My wife boycotts any business with unisex loos unless it is clearly impracticable (eg a small coffee shop with one loo), and I totally support her. We no longer shop in Liberty, for example.

    • Matty says:

      2 Aug2 August 08:28

      Does your wife boycott BA then? The toilets onboard their aircraft are unisex…

      • jj says:

        2 Aug2 August 08:36

        Guess you’re a bloke, Matty? You clearly have difficulty understanding the issues that women face.

        • Sarah says:

          2 Aug2 August 09:56

          I’m a woman and this isn’t an issue

    • Novice says:

      2 Aug2 August 08:37

      Totally agree. Imagine a person with OCD (myself) having to put up with this sort of filth. I’m known to hold my wee just to avoid using toilets which have a high likelihood of being filthy.

      I have noticed though that if desperate the best places to go toilet are 5* hotels. Their lobby toilets are usually decent and clean. But, this obviously can’t be done in an airport or flight so it’s a bit of a nightmare.

      I liked the German system when I was there I saw toilet seats rotated and cleaned themselves. It was awesome.

      • Gordon says:

        2 Aug2 August 08:56

        Agree re German toilets, My wife has an issue with public toilets, Our visit to Berlin in November I know will not be a problem for her. I noticed that on our visit to Nüremberg recently Germany does invest a lot in their infrastructure. The subway from the airport, and in general was a pleasure to travel on.

        • J says:

          2 Aug2 August 10:05

          To manage your expectations Berlin is a world away from Nüremberg and anywhere in Bavaria, and is comparatively filthy. Great city but don’t expect cleanliness!

        • Bagoly says:

          2 Aug2 August 10:46

          Yes, Belarusans who escape the dictatorship and we take to Berlin are regularly horrified by how dirty it is.

        • Bagoly says:

          2 Aug2 August 10:55

          One of the reasons that German loos are clean (even in shopping centres) is because they staff them full-time (except perhaps the last hour of opening), and charge 50 eurocents, whether formally, or informally with a plate left out.

          I fully understand local councils in the UK saying that it’s too expensive to keep public loos clean for free – the answer is to charge for them rather than close them, but that requires a cultural shift of enough users willing to pay. Exposure to the German system where one has such a better experience has made me think that is preferable.

      • Bagoly says:

        2 Aug2 August 10:48

        Cleaning themselves is something I know from Japan – but where in Germany?

        I agree about the 5* hotels, but two rules are:
        1) the visitor should be smartly dressed
        2) it’s not allowed to ask where they are – one has to work it out, and most are not obvious deliberately to avoid casual visitors.

        • Londonsteve says:

          2 Aug2 August 11:57

          I’ve seen plenty of self cleaning toilet seats in Germany. Frequently at motorway service areas and in railway stations. It’s perceived as a bit ‘low grade’ I suspect, so you’re unlikely to find them in a hotel, restaurant or anywhere ‘classy’.

        • Novice says:

          2 Aug2 August 18:25

          I went a few years ago and I’m sure the toilet seat rotated or something itself somewhere during my tour. Can’t remember where as I don’t mk a habit of using public toilets. 😂

        • Novice says:

          2 Aug2 August 18:27

          If you have stayed in enough 5* hotels then it’s not hard to figure out and I tend to buy a drink at lobby bar then go toilet.

      • Numpty says:

        2 Aug2 August 12:30

        This is one long thread! I had to google self cleaning toilet seat germany….found a video, that’s amazing!

    • Ken says:

      2 Aug2 August 08:38

      While I’d broadly agree, but you’ve clearly never worked in a nightclub if you think women’s toilets are invariably cleaner than mens.

      • Bagoly says:

        2 Aug2 August 10:49

        Not invariably, but at least 90% of the time.
        In nightclubs most users are, er, not in a fit state to drive. 🙂

    • Rob says:

      2 Aug2 August 08:44

      We have them in our office, never been an issue (and we’ve never had any emails from management saying ‘just wanted to remind you how to use a toilet’ ….).

      • jj says:

        2 Aug2 August 08:56

        I guess there can’t be a problem in any other toilet in the land given that it’s OK in your office.

        Those silly little women, fretting about something so trivial! They just need a patronising male to rumple their curls and tell them it’s all OK, and it’s nice of you play that father figure, Rob.

        • Rob says:

          2 Aug2 August 09:11

          I think we’re a disproportionately female building to be honest.

          And we’ve had emails from management ‘reminding’ us how to use pretty much everything else, including how we are meant to select the correct mug for the beverage we want to consume in the kitchen ….

        • iain says:

          2 Aug2 August 09:58

          It’s okay for you to speak on their behalf of course.

    • MPC says:

      2 Aug2 August 09:29

      Having worked on the helpdesk of one of the largest cleaning and facilities management companies in the UK in a very former life, I can assure you that there are some much worse fates lurking for you in the ladies cubicles rather than urine on a seat.

      I think we can all agree however that train toilets are in a particularly disgusting niche all on their own.

    • Sarah says:

      2 Aug2 August 09:55

      What a bizarre comment. I’ve been a cleaner and women piss on the floor, on the seat, leave tampons and towels strewn about, blood on walls. Unisex loos with self contained sinks are much more private and useful than loos with communal sinks.

    • Bagoly says:

      2 Aug2 August 10:42

      @jj Thank you for that – I had not previously considered that angle, but I do very much understand it.
      I think “poo” and “were” have not just a typo, but are the wrong way round?

    • Dawn says:

      2 Aug2 August 14:35

      I was about to post a comment saying that all the ‘Toilet’ comments have been from males and now nice to see that JJ has mentioned the issues that women face with Unisex toilets.
      I am fed up with having to clean up the Unisex toilet so I can actually sit on the seat – I”m short so ‘hovering’ doesn’t work for me.
      Many men have no accuracy at all, pissing all over the seat. Worse still , if the toilet paper has run out, how am I supposed to clean it? Thankfully I carry my own when travelling just in case.
      I am not trying to stereotype as I am sure that HFP has many males who will clean up the toilet after they have been in it, but the majority of the time, having to use a Unisex toilet is a totally unpleasant experience and I’m not impressed at all that I have to now use these in the BA lounges.

      • Sarah says:

        3 Aug3 August 08:56

        I’m not a man and I don’t mind unisex loos.

  • Lynn says:

    2 Aug2 August 08:23

    Brilliantly put, couldn’t agree more.

  • Milaneser says:

    2 Aug2 August 08:49

    Lol! Being both i) male and ii) someone that has spent a disproportionately large amount of time studying the science behind spotkicks, I can confirm that this is most definitely true.

  • Sarah says:

    2 Aug2 August 09:05

    I completely agree, I’m sure the men using the lounges will be happy to have access to more toilets, but for women, it just means that we’re now going to be subjected to dirtier, urine covered toilets. I’m sure I’m not the only woman who thought this was an awful idea when I read this news and am really disappointed that BA think so little of their female passengers that they’re subjecting us to this. I understand that on board it isn’t practical to have segregated loos, but they should be able to do this on the ground.

  • Amy C says:

    2 Aug2 August 09:05

    Exactly this!!! Vile.

    • To dare is to do says:

      2 Aug2 August 09:27

      I also agree with Sarah and Amy, and we haven’t even started on the please put the toilet seat back down issue. I don’t even like people using my toilet at home, I turned a cupboard into downstairs toilet so they don’t use my bidet toilet with heated seat and washing/ drying functions.

      • Danny says:

        2 Aug2 August 10:44

        If it’s any consolation, I have never seen urine-soaked floors, walls or toilet seats in the T5 Galleries facilities….Perhaps the gents who fly business class are not all heathens

      • Guernsey Globetrotter says:

        2 Aug2 August 15:26

        Why exactly should a man who urinates standing then put the seat back down afterwards? In a unisex toilet scenario the next user is just as likely to be a man wanting to do number ones and so there is no point… I never understand this argument?! Unless you are from the school of thought that the seat and lid should be placed back down for every flush, in which case you’ll have to touch the lid to lift it again when you enter and also close it after you’ve used the toilet to flush also!

      • The Savage Squirrel says:

        2 Aug2 August 18:44

        @To dare is to do. In public toilets at least, surely if the default storage position for the seat was up then it reduces the problem of urine-soaked seat. In fact if the seat was (gently!) sprung so as to lift up whenever not in use then it virtually guarantees a urine-free seat. A win for everyone?

        • Novice says:

          2 Aug2 August 21:59

          @savage squirrel I agree there should be a way to get it up and down without touching.

      • Novice says:

        2 Aug2 August 21:56

        😂

        It’s all to please the minority trans ppl. It’s all getting mad now trying to categorise everything as being ‘for’ equality. It’s just taking away the rights of biological women to virtue signal and pander to a mental illness really.

        Probably nobody would agree with me but I’m a logical person and I suffer from mental health problem which in my case is OCD. Nobody is changing anything for me or celebrating my ocd telling me how I’m so special and precious because of it so I don’t understand why gender dysphoria is something special.

        • yorkieflyer says:

          2 Aug2 August 23:00

          Novice I think your view is far more mainstream than the chattering classes acknowledge

  • yorkieflyer says:

    2 Aug2 August 10:09

    You expect me to sit down?!

    • Rob says:

      2 Aug2 August 10:31

      Virtually all German men sit down to pee.

      • Bagoly says:

        2 Aug2 August 10:34

        Indeed, and in offices in Switzerland with foreign visitors I have seen signs requesting it.

        • MPC says:

          2 Aug2 August 11:42

          I sit down to pee if I think I deserve it, it’s like a little treat to take 1 min to myself!

      • TimM says:

        2 Aug2 August 11:55

        @Rob, how do you know?

      • Londonsteve says:

        2 Aug2 August 12:01

        I believe the issue is divisive and those that do are somewhat caustically referred to as a sitzenpisser!

      • yorkieflyer says:

        2 Aug2 August 15:46

        I could ask how you knew but perhaps I’d better not……

      • yorkieflyer says:

        2 Aug2 August 15:47

        The seat would be too close for comfort if you get my drift?

        • David says:

          2 Aug2 August 19:43

          No.
          But you do seem oddly threatened by the prospect of men sitting to pee.

      • yorkieflyer says:

        3 Aug3 August 15:49

        Perhaps their loos are cleaner than the average UK one? Point and shoot every time for me, avoids manhandling the furniture especially given the 50/50 prospect at best of soap and water, not that in my experience most men avail themselves of such things

      • Dawn says:

        3 Aug3 August 16:04

        Our friend in Germany even has a notice in her loo at home telling men to sit down.
        On a yacht, all the men I know sit down as there is so much movement. I’d like a notice on the plane too saying ‘Sit Down’ for males. Again, I’ve had to mop up both the seat and the floor before being able to use a plane toilet.

      • Lady London says:

        3 Aug3 August 19:49

        That’s why they lost the war.

• RobertP says:

  2 Aug2 August 07:55

  BA are so much behind the curve on short haul snacks and most other things….and a token offering on certain flights. This is why BA is being left behind other full service carriers…..Example Turkish Airlines for economy passengers….free full meal, free inflight entertainment, free newspapers, better legroom and just a better overall experience….I worked for BA and the decline continues with token gestures that are embarassing from he BA leadership team. The name and legacy isn’t enough in the modern world BA nor is just cost cutting in years past and creaking failing IT system.

  • JDB says:

    2 Aug2 August 08:28

    BA’s service standards are more aligned to those of other European legacy carriers who all suffer issues not faced by Turkish which also isn’t required to be as commercial.

  • Shanghaiguizi says:

    2 Aug2 August 08:54

    Couldn’t agree more Robert. The fanboys and those locked into BA through corporate deals will be claiming the banana cake and sultana flapjack is the best they’ve ever had on any airline in the history of the world. Hopefully in the next few days we’ll also be graced with a promo photo of said banana cake proudly exclaiming BA short haul cuisine is the best in the industry 😉 jk Rhys

  • Londonsteve says:

    2 Aug2 August 12:08

    It’s interesting how in the drive to become more competitive it has allowed BA to lower its average prices, but on a route like Istanbul, the traveller with a choice and some knowledge about the superior in-flight service on Turkish is, quite understandably, choosing to flying with Turkish. As a result they can charge higher average prices (roughly double in the J cabin) and (presumably) make a higher margin per passenger by carrying the mantle of quality. BA’s pricing appears to heavily depend on how many US transit passengers or central and west London business travellers they’ve got booked on a given flight, in the absence of which they’ve got to heavily discount to get bums on seats and effectively take business away from Easyjet and the like, whereas any travellers chasing quality (whether they are user chooser business flyers or self funded) won’t gravitate to BA as it currently stands.

    • JDB says:

      2 Aug2 August 13:44

      A great many TK passengers are connecting in Istanbul and they definitely aren’t paying double for the LHR leg. BA does OK on that route as many either mistakenly don’t fancy TK or want BA TP/Avios. BA and other European legacy carriers find themselves obliged to compete on price vs LCCs as they have all tried and failed to compete on service and discovered that there just aren’t enough people willing to pay a premium price.

      • Londonsteve says:

        3 Aug3 August 12:11

        Fair comment. In short, we (and some other European nations) get the airlines we deserve because we’ve en masse defected to LCCs for short haul? It’s not a surprise that people aren’t an enemy of their bank balance so perhaps the underlying ‘problem’ rests with open skies that opened the floodgates? Not being an airline exec I’d have guessed that a very high percentage of BA short haul flyers are transiting from a long haul service and therefore they’re not about to continue their journey on an LCC but from a profitability perspective, these pax might be worse than a typical point-to-point short haul flyer as they’ve often paid less for their transit fare than what a direct to London would cost on the long haul leg, hence BA is apportioning low revenue to the feeder flights.

• Tony says:

  2 Aug2 August 07:58

  Let’s hope Calum Laming discovers very quickly how many passengers are utterly pissed off with BA, waiting for months for BA to pay them money that is owed.
  Cancelled flights…I am still waiting after months having paid for my own hotel, taxis, food.
  Time for the Small Claims Court!!

  • JDB says:

    2 Aug2 August 08:16

    There is no need to wait beyond the eight weeks that allows you to go to CEDR and you can go to MCOL even before that – after four to six weeks, just advise BA that you will take this action if your claim isn’t paid after 14 days.

    For what it’s worth, this isn’t just a BA issue – BA is probably around the middle, or a bit above the average of European airlines for dealing with / paying claims.

• Gordon says:

  2 Aug2 August 08:14

  A few grumpy commenters on here this morning! BA have extended their double tier points promotion until December 2024, Maybe that will put a smile on your face….

  • Andrew J says:

    2 Aug2 August 08:17

    That was announced weeks ago.

    • Gordon says:

      2 Aug2 August 08:21

      Im always a few weeks behind!

      • Anna says:

        2 Aug2 August 12:13

        Wait till you find out Amex are stopping pro-rata refunds 😂

        • Gordon says:

          2 Aug2 August 13:05

          ARE THEY 😂

• Lynn says:

  2 Aug2 August 08:17

  If the cubicles are “sealed” I don’t have an issue with unisex loos from a safety point of view. However, my issue with unisex toilets is from a hygiene perspective. As a wife, mother and grandmother, with a nursing background, my experience tells me that most males do not have a very good aim ( unlike Elvis Costello lol ). I do not want to have to clean pee up before I can use the toilet. I hope BA are going to employ a heck of a lot more cleaners.

  • Sarah says:

    2 Aug2 August 09:58

    Lots of women don’t either as many refuse to sit on the seat and instead hover

• Gavin says:

  2 Aug2 August 08:19

  The lounge toilets are just a really stupid layout, I can’t believe someone actually designed them like this. Already mentioned in other comments, but to summarise:

  1) No urinals, so men have to waste time when they only need a quick wee. Big queues for no reason.

  2) Can’t tell if stalls are occupied, so lots of people wandering up and down, not sure exactly what’s going on, stalls not being occupied to maximum efficiency.

  3) Private room layout with individual rooms, meaning if someone just wants to wash their hands or use a mirror etc they will have to occupy an entire toilet.

  • sigma421 says:

    2 Aug2 August 11:05

    This is my biggest gripe – it’s just a terrible use of space. The rooms are far bigger than they’d need to be if they just built normal toilets By all means keep a couple of gender neutral ones for those who’d prefer such a facility but the lack of urinals is just massively inefficient.

  • TimM says:

    2 Aug2 August 11:58

    Gavin >> “Can’t tell if stalls are occupied”
    Transparent doors?

    • Anna says:

      2 Aug2 August 12:15

      Don’t give people ideas! It’s bad enough with this trend for transparent bathrooms in hotels.

  • JK says:

    2 Aug2 August 12:01

    Spot on. Ridiculous design.

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