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Back in October 2024 I was due to return to lhr from Amman with BA at 9.35am in CW. Less than a week before the flight was cancelled. They refused to reroute us on the 12pm direct RJ flight, and instead sent us via Doha with Qatar & Etihad. The first leg we were downgraded to economy, and we arrived home over 8 hrs later than planned. I immediately put in a delay and downgrade claim.
They have sent us £34! downgrade expenses back in November, which I queried and heard no response, then last night I received an email saying £34 was all we were due as “ the flight was cancelled due to the current political situation in the Middle East”. Is it worth going back to them? I’ve not had a cancellation of this nature before .. we were on a BA Holiday flight and hotel.The reason for the cancellation shouldn’t affect any downgrade compensation, but it’s not straightforward to calculate what you would be owed as it was a BAH booking. What sort of figure were you expecting? I imagine AMM-DOH is quite a short flight?
What reason were you given for the cancellation in the first instance?
I do sympathise as BA sent you on a very convoluted route home! Possibly the RJ flight was full if lots of people were trying to leave the region?
Did you ask to be put on the RJ flight (I’m assuming so)? And were there seats available on it when you asked? If the answer to both of those is yes then you have a case for cancellation compensation. The “political situation” ie war in the area is definitely extraordinary circumstances, but BA also need to make all reasonable efforts, and refusing to put you on a direct flight at a similar time is not making all reasonable efforts.
Obviously if there were no seats available then BA couldn’t do anything, so no compensation would be due.
You should be entitled to some downgrade compensation for the downgraded sector but it may not amount to much at all – either 30 or 50% for that sector only and it isn’t subject to any extraordinary circumstances defence. The delay or cancellation compensation is tougher in the circumstances. BA hasn’t expressed itself well but may have a full defence.
Thanks for the replies. Yes we did ask to be put on the direct RJ flight several times. I was told that it’s only available for same day cancellations. They did have space as I checked it before got in contact, but not sure I can prove that now. If I was at home I would have done a lot of research and saved it, but we were already away unfortunately. Doesn’t sound like it’s worth persevering, although I do have the chat transcript where they refused the direct flight.
Thanks for the replies. Yes we did ask to be put on the direct RJ flight several times. I was told that it’s only available for same day cancellations. They did have space as I checked it before got in contact, but not sure I can prove that now. If I was at home I would have done a lot of research and saved it, but we were already away unfortunately. Doesn’t sound like it’s worth persevering, although I do have the chat transcript where they refused the direct flight.
The issue at that time was that RJ, even as a OW member, wasn’t accepting BA advance cancelled pax, so the availability of seats or otherwise becomes immaterial.
It’s been more than 8 weeks since you claimed, so I would go to CEDR. Your claim would be that your flight was cancelled due to exceptional circumstances, but BA failed to take all reasonable measures because they refused to put you on a flight with available seats, therefore compensation is due. Aside from anything else, it will cost you nothing other than a small amount of time to claim.
I am very unconvinced that the terms of any agreement between BA and RJ matter. Seats were available therefore BA could have got you home on them. They chose not to because they’d have to pay full price. BA also refuse to (“can’t”) rebook on Easyjet due to lack of an agreement, but that is also not taking all reasonable measures.
Not saying it’s a guaranteed win, but I’d certainly be trying if I were you.
While these cases always turn on their individual facts and will even depend which adjudicator or judge decides the case, the issue of ‘availability’ is well tested and anyway neither the rules nor the guidance require an airline to offer the passenger a flight of their choice and even the timeliness of any rerouting is intentionally vague.
The issue of BA (and other network airlines) not booking EasyJet and other LCCs is not BA being difficult but those other airlines not accepting their bookings nor being part of the airline clearing house.
What’s to stop BA or those other airlines making a direct booking via EasyJet’s website or other process?
What’s to stop BA or those other airlines making a direct booking via EasyJet’s website or other process?
Because it would require an agent to pay for the ticket, which has more implications than just who/how it’s paid for. LCCs operate outside inter airline reservation and payment systems.
It’s wholly impractical and far beyond the ‘reasonable measures’ referenced above, so in these instances a passenger needs to buy the LCC tickets and seek reimbursement which they will get as long as their purchase meets the CJEU’s “necessary, appropriate and reasonable” test.
I think these days Amman is considered a Club Europe shorthaul+ destination and operated by an A320? In which case the fact that they sent you via DOH means that you ended up in a proper longhaul business class seat on the longest sector of your rerouted journey and only travelled in economy from AMM to DOH? I think while you suffered a long indirect journey home the reality is that you didn’t really suffer a severe downgrade.
In terms of compensation you should have asked for cancellation rather than delay. But what time did your rerouted flight depart AMM versus the original 9:35am departure. I ask because the compensation is potentially payable unless the reroute offered allows you to depart no more than one hour before orginal scheduled departure and arrive less than two hours of original scheduled arrival. You say that you arrived 8 hours later than scheduled so it looks like you’re eligible however it all depends on how true BA’s statement is that “the flight was cancelled due to the current political situation in the Middle East”. I do think BA had issues due to the Israel / Gaza war and maybe that was the cause of the cancellation of AMM-LHR flights. Seems reasonable that is an exceptional cause. If you think BA is being unreasonable ypu can go to CEDR. Personally I’d give BA the benefit of doubt here.
It has to be the very definition of extraordinary circumstance, with natural disasters, so no UK261.
They should definitely reimburse reasonable expenses. As for the downgrade, it is a difficult one, given the other much nicer flight.
If airlines were to pay normal prices to rebook on other airlines, prices would skyrocket. Ryanair already saying eu/uk261 is 5/10% of ticket price.Yes, it seems quite unreasonable to be asking for compensation in these circumstances. It’s not as if BA cancelled the flights for fun, but then on another thread someone was asking for compensation for a recent disrupted journey flying from Toronto shortly after the accident. It seems quite embarrassing to be thinking about it let alone posting about it.
Yes, it seems quite unreasonable to be asking for compensation in these circumstances. It’s not as if BA cancelled the flights for fun, but then on another thread someone was asking for compensation for a recent disrupted journey flying from Toronto shortly after the accident. It seems quite embarrassing to be thinking about it let alone posting about it.
I agree , in these circumstances expect duty of care but no more. Not just legally, but morally.
…If airlines were to pay normal prices to rebook on other airlines, prices would skyrocket. Ryanair already saying eu/uk261 is 5/10% of ticket price.
The BA flight that I was re-routed on recently by BACF on a peak travel day was priced at 980 Euro in economy for a 125 minute flight, I’m pleased BA missed out on selling the seat at a massive profit.
Back in October 2024 I was due to return to lhr from Amman with BA at 9.35am in CW. Less than a week before the flight was cancelled. They refused to reroute us on the 12pm direct RJ flight, and instead sent us via Doha with Qatar & Etihad. The first leg we were downgraded to economy, and we arrived home over 8 hrs later than planned. I immediately put in a delay and downgrade claim.
They have sent us £34! downgrade expenses back in November, which I queried and heard no response, then last night I received an email saying £34 was all we were due as “ the flight was cancelled due to the current political situation in the Middle East”. Is it worth going back to them? I’ve not had a cancellation of this nature before .. we were on a BA Holiday flight and hotel.Let me get this straight. You flew QR business class possibly in Q suite rather than Club Europe from DOH to LHR but on the hop from AMM to DOH it was Y. You think as a result that BA should compensate you beyond the £34 they already have. I imagine you also got into the lounge at DOH and while the 8 hour delay was unfortunate, not even I would try to extort anything further from BA, and trust me I claim for everything!
They had a duty of care, the exercised it, I think very well in the circumstances. Pursuing this further would be foolish…If airlines were to pay normal prices to rebook on other airlines, prices would skyrocket. Ryanair already saying eu/uk261 is 5/10% of ticket price.
The BA flight that I was re-routed on recently by BACF on a peak travel day was priced at 980 Euro in economy for a 125 minute flight, I’m pleased BA missed out on selling the seat at a massive profit.
I know there’s an abhorrence on this site if any company makes any money, but an airline needs profits to fund new aircraft, new routes, more staff, better IT, improved lounges etc. None of this is free and nor can it be paid for out of losses.
The only question that arises is how such profits are divided between the different stakeholders.
@JDB BACF and BA didn’t re-route me on earlier cheaper flights because they can’t get their re-routing act together. They would’ve saved Art. 9 costs aswell.
The flight cancellation was in non-extraordinary circumstances which I’ve received £220 compensation for.
What’s abhorrent is IAG’s incompetence that probably reduces their profit in certain cost centres.
I’ll be seaching CAA, ENAC and EASA records over the next months/ years and doing FOIs to get a crystal clear picture of why the BACF flight was cancelled.The issue at that time was that RJ, even as a OW member, wasn’t accepting BA advance cancelled pax, so the availability of seats or otherwise becomes immaterial.
That issue was BA’s issue not the passenger’s. Passenger doesn’t have a right to choose which flight he’s rerouted on. But he does have a right to choose to be rerouted at as near the timing of his original flight as possible.
If other airlines are flying that can meet this passenger’s need, and BA is only offering following day travel or significantly later (that suita BA) then BA should procure any seat being sold to mert passenger’s statement he chooses to travel at or near same timing. Inter-airline spats and friends or alliances, or inter-airline refusal to provide at an interline fare rate that suits BA, should not be allowed to override the passenger’s statutory rights.
There’s already a hint as to tbe imtentions of tbe legizlators that tbis sort of stuff should not be allowed to go on, in the statement in the legislation that airline is not allowed to insist on an award seat being available if rerouting awards passenger should be rerouted into any available seat. And available obvs means available on the aircraft, not just available at a price that suits BA. The CAA has also reminded airlines thar other airlines’ flights must also be taken account of when fulfilling rerouting rights.
BA is responsible for providing passengers’ rights and in tbis case has not made reasonable efforts. Tbey are a commercial operation and their costing of tbeir own failures needs to take account of the overriding legislation they are subject to. Not having a cheap option for them, haa nothing to do with it if tbere are clearly seats available (eg not just to BA but to any paying passenger) in accordance with passengers’ rights.
So I appreciate being helped to understand what circumstances BA is operating under but inter-aurline pricing issues are not the passenger’s. Make a claim as AJA says.
@LadyLondon just to be clear I am not in favour of making a claim in this case. I think BA does have an exceptional circumstances fallback. I was saying OP could go to CEDR if they wish to pursue a claim but I think BA has a defence.
Yes possibly an exempt reason could be claimed by the airline. But they didn’t reroute reasonably according to passenger’s need to keep as close as poss to original flight timing when there were seats available. Passenger also arrived 8 hours late so was delayed unnecessarily. 8 hours is a big delay on a shortish route like Amman.
@Lady London is correct here. The EU/UK261 legislation is aimed to provide passenger protection (I believe there’s even a legislative preamble to state that).
You are of course free not to claim if you think that it would be wrong to do so – BA will definitely not chase you to hand you the money. The aim of the legislation around delays and cancellations is to encourage airlines to get passengers where they are supposed to be quickly. BA appear to have failed to do that here, so I wouldn’t be thinking too long about claiming.
@AJA – Exceptional circumstances in this area has 2 legs. There certainly were exceptional circumstances, but BA also have to make all reasonable efforts, which includes booking on other airlines where available. They can choose not to do so, as in this case, but that then makes them liable to pay compensation for the resultant delays...exceptional circumstances, but BA also have to make all reasonable efforts,..
@Matt Do you mean extraordinary circumstances and reasonable measures?@Matt – there’s a fundamental misunderstanding and/or misinterpretation of the legislation in your post.
The ‘reasonable measures’ second leg of the ‘extraordinary circumstances’ defence relates only to cancellation or delay but has nothing to do with the consequent rerouting. BA cancelled its flights to Amman for well known reasons which would be generally considered to constitute ’extraordinary circumstances’ and ones for which no ‘reasonable measures’ could have been taken to avoid cancellation.
On what basis do you say the passenger could claim cancellation compensation?
Whether the passenger was appropriately rerouted is an entirely different question and not one for which ‘reasonable measures’ applies, even if there’s a test (inter alia) of reasonableness. If the passenger was not satisfied with BA’s offer of rerouting via Doha and had bought replacement tickets on RJ, would the cost claimed meet the three part CJEU test of “necessary, appropriate and reasonable”? Would you have risked your own money on this basis?
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