The new British Airways Club World cabin …. some info emerges

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• Aliks says:

  15 Jan15 January 06:05

  If the Lloyds Avios vouchers are disappearing, the only commitment I have to BA will be the 2for1 BAPP voucher.

  Just flew with an Avios redemption on Sri Lankan from Colombo to Male in Economy 1hr 20m but had a pretty good curry meal and coffee – I think there are quite a few nonBA redemptions that will be taking my money in future

  • Anon says:

    15 Jan15 January 08:10

    Agreed and even booking the rtn leg of a BAPP 241 voucher 355 days out has become a major PitA. BAEC USA no longer allowing UK registered BAEC a/c members to book as soon as flights are loaded at 12 midnight GMT;

    This is “an Enhancement for all EC members, you have to wait until the UK office is open”

    This stern and terse comment was followed by “the flights are being loaded at 1am GMT so that US members cant book them either.”

    Total BS – flighs at 355 days out get loaded at midnight GMT/UTC/Zulu, the BA app shows them being loaded and then disappearing as people book them within minutes..

    Which of course means by the time the UK call centres open there’s no availability for UK residents on returns from popular routes like Maldives, Singapore, etc, etc.

    Looks like BA is ensuring 2017 is going the way of 2016..

    • Rob says:

      15 Jan15 January 09:24

      Yes, covering this soon.

    • Daz says:

      15 Jan15 January 10:35

      Remember Zulu and GMT are not always aligned due to UK seasonal time changes.

      Roger out!

      • Anon says:

        15 Jan15 January 11:26

        Really how?

        I thought Zulu was always UTC and hence GMT.

        ie GMT still exists even when the UK is on BST.

        • Daz says:

          15 Jan15 January 12:26

          You are correct – Let me clarify my response as your initial post can be taken as someone who thinks that UK time is alway GMT or Zulu, which it is not:

          “This stern and terse comment was followed by “the flights are being loaded at 1am GMT so that US members cant book them either.
          Total BS – flighs [sic] at 355 days out get loaded at midnight GMT/UTC/Zulu, the BA app shows them being loaded and then disappearing as people book them within minutes..”

          Flights can be loaded at 2359/0001hrs GMT/ZULU and hence be 0100hrs UK time due to the UK seasonal time changes or BST (UTC+1/Zulu+1). Some people think GMT and UK time are the same all year round and use the term as such.

  • James67 says:

    15 Jan15 January 07:17

    Similar here, I save for one pair of longhand flights a year. Will now need to apply for BAPP to make it work though as tax and fees so high. If I find KLM works for me exEDI when seasonal AY isn’t available I’ll probably just drop BA altogether and use avios for regional flights on MH and CX. Agree on UL, December to unpretentious products and service which are superior to BA at prices offering good value.

  • Rob says:

    15 Jan15 January 09:25

    No-one is saying they definitely are going, for clarity.

  • John says:

    15 Jan15 January 09:53

    I still think BAEC is the easiest way to OWS or OWE for many and if I have to take 4 BA flights then that’s fine.

• krys_k says:

  15 Jan15 January 06:14

  “We saw it happen on the A380 aircraft”…must have missed this one. Can someone elaborate?

  • JAXBA says:

    15 Jan15 January 06:26

    Perhaps referring to the tasting menu that was in First on the A380 but was discontinued (as well as the amuse-bouche and bistro menu from F in general).

    • Rob says:

      15 Jan15 January 09:25

      Yes, I was

• James67 says:

  15 Jan15 January 07:02

  All this looks like more strike days to me. BA cabin density combined with MF staff on exploitation wages and dine when you like sounds like a disaster waiting to happen, morale will be rock bottom as the opportunity for rest on longhaul flights will be limited. I imagine staff will not want to work the CW cabin. I don’t understand why, on the back of recent obvious cutbacks on both the quality and quantity of food, BA suddenly does an about turn. Their management and strategic planning seems to be all over the place.

  • Mike says:

    15 Jan15 January 09:27

    My thoughts too and you know when – Easter !!

    • Rich. says:

      15 Jan15 January 10:08

      Totally agree with these comments,…..

    • Rob says:

      15 Jan15 January 17:09

      Apparently this is already brewing. One crew member told me she has been offered an effective £300 pay rise which would be her standard annual rise but includes a premium for agreeing to the new CW service pattern.

      Of course, you could argue that as the crew are being paid to be in the air then they should do whatever BA tells them to do during that time ….

      • James67 says:

        15 Jan15 January 17:50

        I guess I will need to rethink my attitude to the ME3 employment practices, it would no longer surprise me if BA were worse. However, it seems like the problems may be rife industry-wide. I was friendly with a guy who is a purser with CX when I was in London and he claims management of cabin crew has been strained for years. According to him, business class is the least favoured cabin to work at CX because there are relatively too many demanding passengers to crew and they are kept on the go constantly throughout longhaul flights. Apparently CX flight attendants really hate 777s and were disappointec the airline did not go for a380s. I hooe they will bd happier with the a350s.

        • the real harry1 says:

          15 Jan15 January 18:00

          not sure if a cabin crew job should be worth more than £20K

          it’s quite glamorous with the stopovers & expenses in exotic places

          combined with a basic drudge/ service job dealing with a combination of nice & horrible people – you don’t exactly need a degree in physics, just be happy to deal with people

        • Callum says:

          16 Jan16 January 07:12

          Therealharry1 – Exactly what I was going to say. It seems tied into the impression many people still have that flying is somehow special. Where’s the outrage over Pizza Express’ wages?

• Paul says:

  15 Jan15 January 07:22

  The “jam tomorrow” approach of BA is not getting me excited and I really can’t see the point of training cabin crew when it will take at least 2 years, and quite probably longer for BA to fit out the fleet. Given their track record with First, you have to question if it will ever happen.
  There was s time when BAs major claim to fame was consisttancy and no matter which aircraft you got on the seats were the same. This is now no longer the case with F which has at least 3 variants and now cramped world is getting the same treatment.
  As it’s BA there will be a lot of hype, a lot of noise and then reality will arrive in the form of a cut price, half hearted attempt at getting CW near to where the competition are now only to find they have marched on again.

  • barry cutters says:

    15 Jan15 January 10:35

    Theres only 2 variants of first .
    I think ‘old’ first is now long gone. i haven’t had it for ages , – i actually preferred that. if it is still used they are not selling it as first i think its just used as extra club seating.
    Then ‘new’ first is on everything else, granted its slightly different layout in the nose of a 747 vs a380 vs 777.
    ‘new new’ first is only on the 789s which i actually liked .
    Its unfair to critizise for having more than one seat as it doesn’t make sense to rib out all first seat and make them the same as the dreamliner9s

    • Rich. says:

      15 Jan15 January 13:59

      No.
      The A380 has a different First seat too.

• Nick says:

  15 Jan15 January 07:35

  “The problem I have with all this is that I would prefer to see the money poured into a market leading hard product. It is possible that BA is going to try something different – rubbish seat but with higher-than-average quality food and drink.”

  I just hope that BA haven’t gone down the uncomfortable ‘skinny’ seat route that they took with Club Europe! It’s certainly hard, but certainly not a market leader!

  • the real harry1 says:

    15 Jan15 January 08:16

    Won’t happen. The CE seat is fine for journeys max about 4hrs or so – how do I know? – well it’s exactly the same as my economy seat on my RFS redemptions! (minus the blocked out middle). Comfortable enough bar the legroom.

    But on longer journeys, CW’d very soon start losing a LOT of business – pax absolutely require a higher level of comfort or would simply vote with their money.

    • Rich. says:

      15 Jan15 January 10:11

      Totally disagree. I don’t appreciate 28-29″ seat pitch and the narrow seats in CE
      With my knees touching the seat in front and insufficient room to use a lap top in Business class…

    • Daz says:

      15 Jan15 January 10:53

      CE is pap, no other words to say on it! They are only good for Avios redemptions for champagne and extra baggage whilst setting up for a longer business class flight from the EU.

      Saying it is suitable at the cost price vs the product and putting up with it means your sights respectfully need readjusting.

      I flew on a budget airline ‘Malindo Air’. From KUL to PEN, less than an hour and they had proper business class seating in a separate cabin in a old 737. The cabin crew were fantasticat all at Easy Jet prices; the same with national Carrier Malaysia from KL to SIN. That’s why CE is a rubbish hard product.

      • TGLoyalty says:

        15 Jan15 January 11:54

        fully agree, can see why they think its a good idea as they can flex the planes but as a product its awful

        Not sure how corporate policies work at other large companies under board level, but ours is up to 4 hours is Eco, 4-10 Premium if available then Business (if no premium or 10+ hours), based on the direct journey times.

        Sure lots of people actually buying business are looking for more than a spare middle seat now days

    • James67 says:

      15 Jan15 January 12:02

      You mean the ET seat with CE ‘service’ I think, let’s not indulge BA. I agree it’s ok for short haul flights but it is what it is and that’s not a premium seat.

      • Leo says:

        15 Jan15 January 12:09

        I didn’t mind it till the legroom went. I actively avoid CE if I can get an exit row – and to be frank it’s easier to ensure this on EZ.

    • John Graham says:

      15 Jan15 January 12:24

      I appreciate your point is that they won’t duplicate CE style seats in CW which I think we could take for granted, however I think you’ll find that a lot of the short haul market sees CE as virtually no better than ET as more space is the single biggest thing they want from a ‘premium’ seat; yet there is clearly a market for people who given the choice will go for premium soft benefits (food/drink) even if the seat isn’t improved, but that niche is covered by WT+ (which it should be noted is an increasingly popular option).

      • the real harry1 says:

        15 Jan15 January 12:40

        exactly my point – I wasn’t trying to say CE is a good product – which is why for my under 3 hr flight out to our place I wouldn’t dream of getting it on RFS redemption, let alone pay for it. Simply not worth it when you can buy a lounge pass for under £20 – the other benefits are minimal.

        But the seat itself is perfectly bearable on short haul, no worse than many 1st class train seats unless you’re a porker I suppose 🙂 . If it were a proper business class seat, I might just on occasion have a different opinion, the 7500 extra Avios & extra fee means it’d be costing me £70 extra, so take off £20 for lounge pass, £24 for 4 G&Ts and you get a comfy seat cost of £36, not so much different to paying for an exit seat! But simply not going to happen in Europe…

        • Rich. says:

          15 Jan15 January 14:04

          Why should CE have to be so tight as to be only “bearable???”
          I have long thighs and broad shoulders and am in no way a porker.
          I used to fly CE for the seat pitch, and fairly comfy seats…… with the ability to catch up on a bit of work if required. All of that is gone now.

        • the real harry1 says:

          15 Jan15 January 17:04

          you might want to compare cost to benefits, though

          even when there were decent CE seats, most big cos – FTSE100 cos – latterly insisted on economy for journeys 4 hrs & under for most staff, even most execs perhaps up to top team -1 – for a reason – it’s not really justifiable when you’re paying cash, the economy seats are perfectly OK posterior-wise & you won’t get much more work done / get more privacy to work etc in Club

          certain people won’t willingly do anything but travel in Club or better for their own reasons, usually money not being much of an issue

          but in value for money terms, cash-wise Club in Europe is exceptionally poor value, not that you’d be bothered if somebody else is paying

          in Avios redemption terms, it’s not particularly bad VFM, I grant you – particularly if you get your Avios cheaply

• James A says:

  15 Jan15 January 07:59

  The rumour is that the Qatar ‘super business ‘ seat was uncomfortably similar to the new Delta seat, hence the delay

• Howard Wiseman says:

  15 Jan15 January 08:23

  Obviously these are not being installed on BA’s cash cow museum pieces ( lovely collection of 30 y/o 747-400 still flying daily from BOS) they insist on flying until some regulator says stop. I would settle for a new screen equal in size to a smartphone.

  • TGLoyalty says:

    15 Jan15 January 08:36

    Haven’t they all be upgraded inside?

    • Alan says:

      15 Jan15 January 08:46

      Not yet – my LGW flight had a dreadful old screen and I was amazed on a recent Chicago flight to have an old plane but with a fantastic tablet replacement fitted with a nice big bright HD screen. At least if they eventually do that across the board it’ll be a bit of an improvement.

      • Will says:

        15 Jan15 January 12:15

        Not been in a non upgraded 744, but the upper deck on the refitted “super hi H” 744’s is tally nice imho.

        • Alan says:

          15 Jan15 January 17:22

          yep, that’s what I had to ORD – was only half-full and I was in 64K as well, superb 😀

• TGLoyalty says:

  15 Jan15 January 08:31

  Isn’t the new Qatar Seat to replace the and 2-2/2 seats on 777’s?

  • Rob says:

    15 Jan15 January 09:23

    Yes, and A350. But they could have done that with the current seat if they chose.

    • Nathan Fox says:

      15 Jan15 January 13:34

      I thought the all A350s were already the “new” layout?

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