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A BA check-in agent writes about how they select passengers for downgrading and offloading

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Regular readers of Head for Points will know that there has been substantial discussion on the site in recent weeks about downgrades.  In particular, the issue is whether British Airways is prioritising Avios tickets, and 241 tickets in particular, because it does not have to pay the legally required EU261 compensation in cash, if at all.

Unfortunately for BA, a regular contributor to HfP was recently downgraded on a 241 ticket.  This means that we will be following his claim for full compensation in real time.

British Airways BA 777X 777 9X

To put the other side of the story, I asked a British Airways check-in agent if they could tell me how the downgrade and offloading system is meant to work.  This is what they said – I have edited the comments to remove any identifying details:

We will be told which flights are oversold at our briefing when we start work that day. Depending on how oversold it is a nominee may be appointed to approach all customers for that destination before they get to the desk, ie. when they enter the queue.   They are given details of the compensation offered by us on the day and the alternative flight we can offer them, together with any info on hotels and transportation to those hotels.  Sometimes we have to re-route via another airport so will send them to overnight up there in readiness.

If the flight is just one or two oversold we will be asked to approach customers as they check in or drop bags. The information of the offer is shown in the header page for that flight together with ‘bail out’ options (as we call it). In fairness some of the newer staff can be scared of asking as any hint of overbooking may worry a customer so being new some of them tend not to ask.

If someone volunteers to come off for cash they are told that they will still travel on the flight if space is available at closure. They will then be on-loaded at that time but in whatever seat is left. So sometimes not the best of options.

If we have no volunteers and all seats have been assigned then the last person to present themselves at check in will be told that unfortunately at this time there is no seat for them and they will be asked to return at flight closure. It’s only at that time will we know if they can get on or not.  If they don’t get on we deal with the initial conversations (never a nice thing to do) and advise the compensation they will receive, etc. A manager will come down and issue the cash card, and we issue vouchers for hotel, meals, etc.

Downgrades can, and do, happen to anyone. Generally those safe will be those who are Gold, Silver or OW equivalent, or those who’ve paid for seats.

These [paid] seats are always held until flight closure and only released if a customer doesn’t arrive in that time. Some of those non status holders will pay to reserve seats as its perhaps a trip of a lifetime to them so they want to be sure of being together. I’ve seen Golds downgraded over others without status because they haven’t held their seat whereas all others have (yes, not often but it can happen). That’s why I always recommend people check in online as soon as they can, even if they can’t print the boarding pass.

If there is possibility of downgrade passengers will still go to the lounge and be told there. If the flight is oversold they will be kept landside.  If we’re expecting downgrades, seats are held in the next cabin down – usually the bulkhead in WT+.

In the situation of an aircraft change, this will generally not affect premium travellers adversely [….]  All would get seats still, though some maybe not the one they wanted.  We struggle more with offloads on these occasions as there are not so many World Traveller seats for downgraded passengers.  Again we deal with that as a voluntary thing seeking volunteers. Again any offloads would be the last ones to check in again, ie. sequence number.

I’ve had a situation at the gate where we had to remove 8 people from the flight because of weather (winds) not allowing enough fuel and all the passengers to travel. We had to ask for volunteers at the gate and we easily got enough. Had we not got enough the manager with me confirmed it would have been last to check in.

So all in all I do think this panic [over Avios passengers being targetted for downgrades] is unfortunate.  Of course things can and do happen but I find it sad that you’re taking one incident and making it seem like it’s happening all the time. From my first hand experience that is not the case at all.

They key thing is if it were, why do we take so much time actively seeking volunteers if we already know who is going to be downgraded?

Thanks for this, I think all of the readers appreciate it.  I would note, however:

Note the comment above about what happens to those who volunteer not to travel.  If it turns out that a seat is available at departure for any reason, your compensation will be rescinded and you will be made to fly in that seat, wherever on the plane it is.

Both of the cases I am currently looking at involved customers who were specifically told by Duty Managers that they had been downgraded because they were on Avios tickets.

When my family was downgraded from Club World three years ago, both myself and my wife were Silver so there was no protection for us as status holders.  The other case I am currently chasing on behalf of a HfP reader was where the reader had paid for seat selection but was on an Avios ticket and was still downgraded, so that is also not a guarantee of safety.

The idea that volunteers are initially sought at check-in is totally at odds with what happened to our contributor.  He was blocked from online check-in and told at Edinburgh that he was being downgraded.  The check-in desks for his flight at Gatwick had not even opened at this point so there clearly had been no attempt to seek volunteers.

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Comments (141)

This article is closed to new comments. Feel free to ask your question in the HfP forums.

  • zsalya says:
    16 Mar16 March 05:58

    On the occasion I was offered a downgrade at the check-in desk, I too had been blocked from online check-in (twelve hours earlier), and arrived three hours before departure, although that was a few years ago.
    Check-in agents would not see that happening.

    • James67 says:
      16 Mar16 March 07:06

      In the previous posts on this I was trying to establish if Anon and others experiencing issues were blocked from OLCI or seat selection. If this is the case it would seem to confirm FLY involvement and could be goid forewarning.case

  • zsalya says:
    16 Mar16 March 06:16

    Has anybody volunteered for bumping and then had to actually wait around until boarding?

    • Hugh says:
      16 Mar16 March 06:51

      Yes
      I was bumped from BA1, and had to wait until the doors closed, before they shoved me in a taxi and sent me of to LHR, with an €600 or upgrade to First offer (this was when this flight attracted 240 TP and I naively declined the offer of €600 thinking I had to travel F to get the tier points)

    • Roosit says:
      16 Mar16 March 07:54

      Yes, about 18 months ago, booked on LHR to SFO, cash tickets, Economy, no status. As far as I can tell we were not targeted, just had a chat with the check-in agent, asked whether the flight was full etc. We had time and were curious, they offered a decent sum in cash (I don’t remember exact amount but it covered a large part of the cash fare) plus meal vouchers and a hotel (we would have been bumped to the next day). We got a meal voucher straight away and had to stay landside. At boarding time we had to present ourselves at a desk near Caffè Nero in T5. When they were about to close the gate they realised there was room for us so we were rushed through and took the original flight. I can’t remember whether we had the seats which were originally allocated to us (we hadn’t paid for seat reservation) but we did still sit together.

      • mark2 says:
        16 Mar16 March 08:09

        So had your luggage been loaded then?

        • Roosit says:
          16 Mar16 March 20:53

          Not initially, luggage was only loaded at that special desk (the exact name escapes me) once they were sure we would be on the plane. I don’t think they would have given us the option to stay back if our luggage had been loaded at the normal check-in desk initially. The reason I say that, on a different occasion, again in conversation with the check-in agent she says oh yes we’re offering people to stay back – why, are you interested? While we think about it she says, oh I can’t give it to you anymore, because I have already loaded your luggage. So I assume (albeit from this experience only) once luggage is in you are going.

    • David P says:
      16 Mar16 March 12:06

      I have as well, about 8 years ago on an LGW-GLA domestic. There had been an equipment change and the flight was oversold so BA staff were asking at check-in for volunteers to be bumped to a later flight. They were proactively offering a few hundred euros as compensation; although I don’t recall the exact amount I presume it would have been in line with EC261. I had no time pressures so volunteered to wait around. In the end there were several no-shows (presumably connecting passengers who were delayed) so I got on my original flight at the last minute, and my checked bag made it with me. It was first off at GLA as well, which was a bonus, although I was quite looking forward to spending the compensation in Glasgow’s bars!

  • Mikeact says:
    16 Mar16 March 06:32

    An interesting reply, to which I will add my thanks too. However, it is not always BA that handle the departing flight. At many stations around the world BA is handled by other airlines etc. What happens about oversold/downgrades in these cases ? In fact my current journey home will be handled by Qantas before my connecting BA flight.

  • Cheshire Pete says:
    16 Mar16 March 06:34

    I’m only making an educated guess here but I totally believe the account given by the BA staff member. From my experience once checkin opens control of the seat allocation on the plane appears to pass from Sales/CS to daily operations. I think the scenario described above is the policy once this handover occurs. Therefore I strongly suspect anyone downgraded Before OLCI is done before control is passed on to daily operations, i.e. revenue/sales driven.

  • James67 says:
    16 Mar16 March 06:59

    This all has the ring of truth for me and I am sure it was their policy and procedure However, the agent does not mention FLY which has been implicated in recent practice and incidents reported on HFP and elsewhere. There are a few obvious lessons here: pay don’t redeen, check in early, select seats, and probably avoid volunteering (except possibly at the gate), and especially if you are a solo traveller. Probably also a good idea not to select WTP bulkhead seats

  • Mozo says:
    16 Mar16 March 07:02

    I note the comment avoid advising online check in. And the fact that this is no guarantee as we have heard the case where checking was refused online.

    I am travelling to Singapore in first on a 241 in a few weeks with a connecting flight from leeds and want to check in as soon as I can to minimise the (hopefully) small risk of this happening.

    In normal circumstances am I able to check in to both flights as soon as the Leeds flight opens as obviously the Singapore flight does not open for check in until a few hours later? If I can (and I think I can but would appreciate confirmation) then theoretically this gives an advantage to people with connecting flights, although as we have heard this obviously does not always work!

    Thoughts?

    • James67 says:
      16 Mar16 March 07:13

      Yes, you can check in for all sectors as soon as first sector opens

      • Mozo says:
        16 Mar16 March 07:14

        Thanks James

      • Chris says:
        16 Mar16 March 09:01

        Is this still the case for a <24hr stopover?
        I'm flying JER-NYC with an overnight in LON but the LON-NYC flight departs less than 24hrs after the JER-LON connecting flight.

    • Mozo says:
      16 Mar16 March 07:13

      That should have said – I note the comment ABOUT advising online check in…..

    • Anna says:
      16 Mar16 March 07:32

      Is your Leeds flight on the same booking reference? I have a long haul in the summer with a connection from MAN. I’ve booked the two legs separately and have two different check in times.

      • Mozo says:
        16 Mar16 March 07:38

        Yes. Both flights are on same booking reference so sounds like I should be able to book in for both flights when the first one opens.

      • Alan says:
        16 Mar16 March 07:38

        Indeed, it needs to be all in one PNR to be able to check-in early for the second flight.

      • James67 says:
        16 Mar16 March 08:51

        Anna, in the past you could call BA CS and ask them to link the flights in such cases. I suspect they will no longer do this because of their new issues with checking baggage on different tickets but it might still be worth a quick call.

        • Anna says:
          16 Mar16 March 09:03

          I’ve tried this – they refused and they also refused to link my booking to the one my husband and son are on (they’re on avios, I’m on cash), so we have no guarantee of even sitting together for our 12 hour flight! Apparently my only option is to check 3 days before the flight, when they will have had their seats allocated as there’s a child passenger on the booking, and hope the seat next to them is still free!

          My feeling from recent dealings with BA is that “NO” is their default setting these days.

          • James67 says:
            16 Mar16 March 09:23

            Appalled but not surprised. There was a time when Ryanair were routinely trashed in media for shoddy practices and poor custoner relations which now seem not so bad compared to what is currently going on at BA,

  • the real harry1 says:
    16 Mar16 March 07:04

    A check-in agent told me the exact same thing that OLCI T-24 is your surest way to guarantee your seat on your plane. Doesn’t exactly help if you are barred from OLCI – but was this because earlier people had already paid for or checked into the available seats? (Anon – were you @ T-24 or later? how many seats in the pool? (ie was it such a small number that we can believe all had been paid for prior or checked into prior to you?)

  • AndyR says:
    16 Mar16 March 07:08

    Does this check-in agent have experience of downgrades when 2-4-1 Avios pax have been travelling? It might just be that all pax were cash flights so followed the normal process?

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