Some more cheerless news about the new ‘densified’ British Airways short-haul aircraft

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• Cheshire Pete says:

  2 Jan2 January 11:01

  Thumbs up for the USBs! Flying from Heathrow on Saturday the CSM we were chatting to was saying he was about to start training in the new plane layouts. We smirked and he smirked back! Actually mostly sitting in CE it would concern me if having only 1 toilet at the back means there will be long queue of people for the front toilets. The ambience of CE needs to be maintained I think. The only way this could possibly happen if queuing was only allowed behind the curtain….

  • Peter Taysum says:

    2 Jan2 January 11:11

    AA quoted federal law to state only use the rest-rooms of your class. SEA to PHL.

  • shd says:

    2 Jan2 January 11:25

    The toilet at the front actually defined as a benefit of CE, is it?

    • Cheshire Pete says:

      2 Jan2 January 12:25

      No and that’s not what I said. But CE is described as having a quieter ambience. So queuing down the CE section shouldn’t be permitted, as it isn’t now. But how BA manage that reducing to 1 toilet for the great majority of passengers is their issue. Be interesting to monitor anyhow!

• Peter Taysum says:

  2 Jan2 January 11:08

  Restricting CE seats due to lack of space for food seems a particularly stupid business model. Surely they could just give the bread out to CE PAX on entering the plane, with the extra bread. That would allow them to give out MORE bread to go with the bread and could allow the whole plane to be CE if the demand is there. How about a panini within a panini with a bread roll and bread pudding? Perhaps a flat bread starter?

  • Cate says:

    2 Jan2 January 12:55

    LoL that made me chuckle 🙂

    Alas this year coming back on an 767 they even ran out of panini and we were only in second row of biz.

• Will Avery says:

  2 Jan2 January 11:31

  Am I missing something? What is the difference in seat pitch? At 6ft 3 how much more crushed will my knees be compared to the existing? What is the difference between the other airlines? Obviously the glorious Qatar state airline of free and democratic Qatar can do no wrong but, apart from a bag of Walkers & a water, I noticed no difference. I don’t really care if the seat is thinner tbh – more concerned about the point my knee bone hits the seat in front.

  • Simon S says:

    2 Jan2 January 13:12

    I’m 6 foot 4 so I feel your pain. Assuming the seats are similar/the same as the new EasyJet seats then we should be fine. More knee room that the current BA seats as the seats are thinner, also the magazine holder thing is a bit lower which also helps.

    • Rob says:

      2 Jan2 January 14:07

      Doctor told us last week that my 6 year old is going to be 6’6′ …. heaven knows what he’s going to do!

      My daughter is now confirmed to be, following bone density scans, 6’1′ by the time she stops.

      • Pangolin says:

        2 Jan2 January 14:15

        But how do you know when the growth is going to stop?

        My elder brother is 6’3 and I was the same height as him at every age but for some reason I stopped growing at 16 and ended up several inches shorter than he is.

        • Rob says:

          2 Jan2 January 16:00

          You stop growing when your bones reach a certain density. This density can be checked by x-ray. My daughter has the bone density of a 12-year old at age 10, so – whilst she is VERY tall – it is not as extreme as it seems (assuming you don’t find 6’1′ for a girl extreme) because she will stop before most other girls.

      • Will says:

        2 Jan2 January 14:24

        Jeepers Rob! Good luck. There is an incentive to fly business or not fly!

      • Leo says:

        2 Jan2 January 15:13

        Some of us already have to deal with that!

  • the_real_a says:

    2 Jan2 January 15:00

    There is plenty of usable space with these seats on vueling, the issue is people not sitting with their backside pushed up to the back of the seat 🙂 If you slouch then your knees will hurt. The backs are ergonomic and I’m quite comfortable for a few hours (i have a bad back). The design flaw i find is lack of padding on the base. You go numb very quickly.

• mark says:

  2 Jan2 January 11:41

  With regards to the seats, my understanding is that this means nothing in terms of comfort or seat pitch and simply takes up less space and weight.

  Nothing to see here folks…

  • Doug M says:

    2 Jan2 January 11:53

    Do you really think the thinner seat will lose nothing in terms of comfort. Do you also think the pitch will decrease exactly by the seat reduction. If the seat truly offered the same comfort level why would they not install them in CE and allow the reduced seat width to provide a little more knee room.
    This is a means to differentiate CE by making ET worse. Speak to people that have flown these seats on other airlines. It might be fine for Paris or Amsterdam, but 2+ hours on these will be no fun.

    • Rob says:

      2 Jan2 January 12:07

      If the seat is so comfy, why are they not putting it throughout the whole plane?!

      • Will says:

        2 Jan2 January 14:25

        I actually think this *could* be a winning move. If I can gain something with the pitch I.e. clever design, re-positioning of the table, fixed seat position then it could be a positive.

      • LondonFoodie says:

        2 Jan2 January 16:45

        I think this is because they want to be able to have 11 rows of CE on busy business routes so need to keep the old seats.

  • Brexit will be bad for Britain for ever says:

    2 Jan2 January 12:40

    Do you work for the Trump PR firm? The lack of recline ability is a HUGE difference.

    It’s fine for a short hop not to recline, but if I’m on anything over 90 mins I like recline a bit, either to get some sleep or because the upright position of the seats can get very painful for some with back issues. I’ve had to fly sleazy and liar air to the med as they were my only choices. 3.5 to 4 hrs onboard was achingly painful even with my lumbar support pillows.

    Those airlines also have no moveable headrests or wings. Are they going too?

    • Will_2 says:

      2 Jan2 January 14:19

      There is no space in Economy to recline without ending up in the persons lap behind you.
      I’m glad they are taking it away.

      • Leo says:

        2 Jan2 January 15:11

        +1

      • S***o says:

        2 Jan2 January 15:19

        +2

      • Sussex Bantam says:

        2 Jan2 January 15:40

        +3

      • shd says:

        2 Jan2 January 16:20

        How far does the top of the existing BA short-haul seat move, laterally, when you go from fully upright to fully reclined? It only feels like 2-3 inches…

    • Will says:

      2 Jan2 January 14:22

      No, not acceptable to recline in these sardine planes. Unless passenger behind is happy. Always think of the impact of the recline from the person in front.

      I actually like enforcing no recline as it evens controls choppers who insist on doing it!

      • Alex W says:

        2 Jan2 January 22:03

        I am 6 feet tall. I have no problems if anyone in front of me wants to recline. It causes me no inconvenience whatsoever, it pivots around the knee area which means my legroom is unaffected. I don’t see what the problem is with reclining.

• will says:

  2 Jan2 January 12:26

  There are no other LCC’s operating from LHR. Given the passenger charges at LHR surely BA should consider the fact that they’ll never be price competitive from that airport and if they want to go LCC then they should roll out those changes at Gatwick or even opening services at luton or stanstead as a test before spending money refitting the LHR fleet.

  Resizeable business class, buy on board, different seats depending on where you sit in economy and only one toilet for upwards of 180 economy passengers.
  They’ve created a very strange short haul product I’ll give them that.

  At least with Ryanair and Easyjet everyone gets the same seat and economy passengers have access to 3 toilets.

  • shd says:

    2 Jan2 January 16:26

    Nothing to do with passenger charges, everything to do with what the competition are doing that affects the base fares that BA pull out of their hat.

    Gatwick’s passenger charge is only ~£6 less than LHR, but thanks to Easyjet being there, by some *miracle* BA can manage to offer us a £60 r/t to Malaga – but only from LGW.

    If that’s possible on a 1000mi LGW route, where are BA’s £66 r/t fares from LHR for much much shorter routes?

    • will says:

      2 Jan2 January 18:54

      To my astonishment there are actually £59 return fares LHR-AGP showing for this feb!

      £6 may not sound like much but it is a 30+% reduction in a specific cost.
      Trawling through landing fees is a bit of a mine field but I could easily imagine that increased aircraft landing fees at LHR could add several pounds and £10 for one leg of a short haul journey is quite a large portion of an airlines costs.

      You’re point is correct in any case, the lack of competition for IAG at LHR really cripples any chance of lower fares or better service. (it’s incredible that it’s allowed when you consider their revenue share agreements at that airport with other oneworld airlines)

      • shd says:

        2 Jan2 January 20:05

        Can you post dates for this £59 ex-LHR round-trip or a screenshot? I can’t see anything even close to that price.

        I see a *half round trip fare* of £52 for the outbound (eg LHR-AGP on Wed 7 Feb, in Basic; also on Wed 14 Feb)

• Scallder says:

  2 Jan2 January 12:33

  OT (but BA related at least) – As a data point, last week, we cancelled a flight booking that was using a 2 for 1 voucher earned in July 2016, and we got rid of the BAPP it was earned on fairly shortly after that. The voucher was returned to the account shortly after the Avios was returned, and the expiry date has stayed the same. Therefore it appears as well as not having to pay on the BAPP, you don’t have to worry about losing the voucher if you cancel the booking you originally use it for.

  • Polly says:

    2 Jan2 January 20:55

    Same here in Dec we just ‘re used it again now for next week..card gone last March! So yes it’s all bs from the amex agents who tell you you must keep the card to preserve the 241 voucher. We cancelled my oh bacc last week but we are using another 241 from it this year too. Good news for us all.

• Alex Jones says:

  2 Jan2 January 13:00

  The person going on about Qatar being undemocratic and all that… rather than using excuses oh behalf of BA how about your democratic EU neighbours airlines that offer a better service than BA? How about Germany and Lufthansa that just earned 5 stars? Oh wait they are funded by the undemocratic fascist German state too?

  Im really sick of racist indirect comments motivated often by jealousy sadly. Qatar is no democracy so is most of the world but don’t blame your problems on others.

  Please keep politics jealousy and racism out of this wonderful blog! Its about airlines flying and how to make most of it. Peace to everyone ✌

  • Radiata says:

    2 Jan2 January 18:22

    Hear, hear…

• Scottydoggiom says:

  2 Jan2 January 13:01

  Im flying CE from Gatwick to Venice at the end of February , do you still get the free middle seat in CE ? or is that a thing of the past now ? is listed as an A320 or A319
  Also , is there enough breakfast options in the Gatwick lounge to be able to skip the hotel breakfast and eat at the airport ?

  • Simon S says:

    2 Jan2 January 13:17

    CE has a fold out table instead of a middle seat, yes. The exception seems to be Row 1, last time I was in 1A it was just a spare seat next to me.

    Breakfast at the lounge is OK in my opinion, not quite a full English buffet but the bacon rolls are quite nice. Yogurt and cereal are also there along with some fruit juice. Depends on how good your hotel is to be honest. At least the BA breakfast is ‘free’!

  • simon says:

    2 Jan2 January 13:24

    if you have a priority pass, at gatwick you can use it at Grain Store and get £15 per person off the bill. We find this is the best option by far when we fly from there…..

    • Will says:

      2 Jan2 January 14:29

      Agreed though I think it is well overpriced if you paid for the menu. Last time we went they weren’t even entertaining letting anyone into lounge. And why bother when you get properly cooked food and coffee (well probably from the microwave still) and it was v quiet when we went.

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