British Airways and Virgin Atlantic announce their return to mainland China

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• mnlbay says:

  3 Feb3 February 06:33

  Worth noting that Upper Class availability is wide open on VS to and from Shanghai. Taxes just £200 on the PVG-LHR leg for 14 hours which is very attractive.

  • BJ says:

    3 Feb3 February 09:11

    VS already dropped HKG, I think I’d be hesitant to trust them with a PVG reservation unless it was close in.

    • Jonathan says:

      3 Feb3 February 09:56

      It was rather weird that HKG got dropped, I always assumed that it was good route for them, although since Covid, entry requirements have been strict…
      But VS would still need to look at how well the route sold prior to December 2019

      • Sam says:

        3 Feb3 February 17:33

        Same here what I’d expect is that there’ll be interline itineraries to Hong Kong with a stopover in Shanghai, via China Eastern’s partnership with Virgin.

    • DavidZ says:

      3 Feb3 February 12:14

      VS has been flying cargo-only flight to PVG even during the height of pandemic and I don’t think they will cut PVG given that PVG is a Skyteam hub (connect to MU/KE for the whole China and East Asia), unless HK where most passengers terminates.

• G says:

  3 Feb3 February 07:14

  Nothing on Seoul, KL or BKK.

  • bafan says:

    3 Feb3 February 08:24

    Low yield destinations. Seoul was always marginal. They haven’t just coincidentally forgotten about these places.

    • sigma421 says:

      3 Feb3 February 08:50

      And I imagine the lack of Russian overflight will have killed the margin. Traffic generally came from the Seoul end and BA doesn’t have big brand presence there. In addition, London isn’t the most useful entry point to europe for a Korean doing a tour as it’s at the far end of the continent from them. Finnair always made more sense.

      • Londonsteve says:

        3 Feb3 February 15:56

        I had a Chinese colleague when I was working in an EU country who explained that the requirement to get an expensive and stringent visa for the UK meant that most Chinese tourists coming to Europe skip the UK entirely. A Schengen visa from any Schengen zone EU country was comparatively straightforward and of course afforded access to a great variety of appealing destinations for one fee. She also felt that the loss of tax free shopping in the UK would adversely affect the number of Chinese visitors. While the BA and VS connections might be able to remain profitable by demand from UK visitors to China seeking to travel with a familiar airline, the UK will struggle to establish and maintain air links with China while we make it so expensive and difficult for Chinese tourists to visit the UK.

        • Peter says:

          3 Feb3 February 20:08

          For tourists maybe, but there’s 150k Chinese students in UK..

        • jingtan says:

          4 Feb4 February 00:41

          Very very true

  • BJ says:

    3 Feb3 February 09:15

    I’ve been told by somebody at BA that BKK will not return even for winter 2023-24. So far the info I have got from them has been 100% reliable.

    • Hbommie says:

      3 Feb3 February 09:21

      Boo!

    • Rhys says:

      3 Feb3 February 09:25

      This is not a surprise, given the lack of aircraft and the fact that pre-covid Bangkok got the grottiest planes because it was a low margin route!

      • jjoohhnn says:

        3 Feb3 February 10:34

        That’s not entirely fair as they had planned to use the 789 to BKK in Summer 2020 although it never happened obviously.

        • Rhys says:

          3 Feb3 February 11:21

          Yes because the previous grotty planes (777) being used would have been refurbished with Club Suite!

      • anon says:

        3 Feb3 February 12:16

        For what it’s worth, the margin of a route doesn’t influence the selection of a refurbished/non-refurbished aircraft. Aircraft are selected on the balance of prem/non-prem capacity (i.e. does this market require a higher balance of prem seats to non-prem, or lower?) and the relative efficiencies of different aircraft over different differences… and then a large chunk of what’s practically fits in the schedule (i.e. where is the aircraft going next and does it ‘work’?).

  • Chris W says:

    3 Feb3 February 09:35

    I don’t expect BKK to ever return but I wish KUL would. It’s a OW hub, somewhat of a business destination, and was handy for redeeming Avios to Asia. Surely its just the sort of ‘long, thin’ route the 787-8 was designed for?

    • Jonathan says:

      3 Feb3 February 09:52

      You book redemption tickets to KUL via ba.com, you’ll just be in MAS plane !

      No CS seats though…

      • Nick says:

        3 Feb3 February 12:23

        KUL is a very expensive route to operate. Requires 4 x pilots, lost revenue from two J seats that BALPA insist be blocked for them (or more typically their daughters or mistresses), and more nights downroute than equivalent westbound flights. Yes that’s all the same as SIN of course, but that route has much higher yields to compensate.

        KUL is one of my favourite routes and I also hope it returns, but it’s unlikely in the foreseeable future. When 77Xs start to arrive and other aircraft are freed up it will likely be reassessed though.

• Hardpack says:

  3 Feb3 February 07:37

  But no tourist visas being issued yet.

  • John says:

    3 Feb3 February 07:42

    You can do the 144 hour “transit” without a visa.

    • G says:

      3 Feb3 February 08:05

      The mind boggles why anyone would want to visit China anyway.

      • mnlbay says:

        3 Feb3 February 08:13

        Family, friends, business

      • S says:

        3 Feb3 February 08:23

        China is a fascinating country with a very long history and culture. Whatever one thinks about the PRC (I’m certainly not a fan) it is an interesting place to visit. Aside from anything else it serves as a warning sign for how dystopian authoritarianism can be…

      • AJA says:

        3 Feb3 February 08:25

        I would like to visit the Great Wall and am intrigued by Shanghai. I don’t agree with the politics of the country in the same way as I don’t agree with the politics of many Middle East nations but that alone is not a reason to avoid travelling to them.

        Same with Russia, Moscow and St Petersburg loom fascinating but I am no fan of the person in charge.

        Personally I don’t see the attraction of Dubai but plenty do travel there.

        I would prefer that we had the personal choice and not be prevented from visiting any particular country – the USA approach of forcing you to have a visa to enter the USA if you choose to visit Cuba is wrong in my opinion.

        • Londonsteve says:

          3 Feb3 February 16:06

          While in general I agree that tourism and politics should be kept separate, there is a threshold when it comes to governments and politics beyond which I feel it’s irresponsible to visit a country. Russia has crossed that threshold and I cannot in all good conscience approve of visiting for tourism, quite apart from which the ‘welcome’ for any western visitor from the authorities and many citizens alike is likely to be exceedingly hostile. I would feel incredibly nervous about visiting Russia as a tourist while travelling on a British passport, for example. When they’ve learned to behave like civilised members of the global community of nations we can reconsider.

        • Londonsteve says:

          3 Feb3 February 16:13

          It’s also interesting how different countries are judged by different yardsticks. The majority of people have no problems with visiting China yet perhaps half my friends and acquaintances have expressed reservations about travelling to Hungary because of the government’s belligerence and anti-democratic inclinations. We expect higher standards of European countries and those whose cultures are similar to our own (e.g. Russia), but we appear are more tolerant of cultures relatively alien to our own who choose to organise their societies in a different manner.

      • DmbG says:

        3 Feb3 February 08:32

        An aging relative perhaps….

      • JDB says:

        3 Feb3 February 08:38

        @G I guess you don’t realise what you are missing. We visited 12 times from the 2010 Expo in Shanghai to 2019 and will go back when things settle. It’s a wonderful country, the sights and vibrancy of the big cities, fantastic historic sites to visit all over the country combined with incredible natural beauty. Amazing, efficient transport systems, superb food with so much variety and the best five star hotels at a fraction of the prices found in other countries.

        • Oliver says:

          3 Feb3 February 11:04

          Cannot agree more. My partner has family in China, We visited every year before covid. It is such a vibrate country, every time we go there, they have new infrastructure, and the cities just changes so quickly. We have been to many developing countries, China is definitely feel much safer and convenient. The ordinary Chinese people are so nice as well. I have only been to major cities in five provinces, I would like to explore more.

        • Michael C says:

          3 Feb3 February 11:18

          Completely agree, @JDB – follows on from your (great) post the other day about many amazing destinations still awaiting us: can’t wait to explore China more.

      • jingtan says:

        3 Feb3 February 09:19

        You gonna miss the most efficient public transport which this country needs most, on time post delivery etc.
        On the other hand, you gonna miss the culture like great wall or the thing in Xian etc…
        China is so big that you could fly 5 hours and still in China.

      • Harry says:

        3 Feb3 February 09:49

        We hired bikes and explored Hangzhou’s West Lake at twilight. Being next to the lake and going over all those ornate stone bridges with the moon shining down is one of my most treasured travel experiences. There’s more to China than the Great Wall…

        • Michael C says:

          3 Feb3 February 11:18

          Noted for…one day! Thanks, @Harry

      • masaccio says:

        3 Feb3 February 12:32

        Possibly controversial for some, but gonna say: best food in the world.

        • Jonathan says:

          3 Feb3 February 12:41

          As long as you know what you’re eating…

• Richie says:

  3 Feb3 February 10:08

  If any HfPer has visited the newish Daxing airport, would be interested to hear your thoughts.

  • jingtan says:

    3 Feb3 February 11:08

    Been there once precovid, when BA was one of the first to operate from Daxing
    It’s one of the best airports basically, new modern, and like a tourism spot at that time and because it was so empty that you see more stuff than passengers.
    It’s designed that you don’t have to walk that long

    • jingtan says:

      3 Feb3 February 11:09

      Staff*

    • Richie says:

      3 Feb3 February 11:19

      Thanks, so the star shape on plan is the way forward?

  • The Original David says:

    3 Feb3 February 11:16

    I’ve flown through it 14 times, what would you like to know? It’s pretty big, the lounge BA used was fairly average, security was a pain (as with all Chinese airports), lots of good dining options in domestic departures (which you can also use on domestic arrivals), there’s a fun facial-recognition thing where the departure screen will tell you your flight, gate and seat number using nothing but your face. The Daxing Airport Express is good except that it only goes as far as Caoqiao and they don’t let you take aerosols on the train. PEK T3 is much more convenient for the city, but PKX is better once you get there. Daxing has Luckin Coffee, which PEK doesn’t.

    • Nick says:

      3 Feb3 February 12:19

      Fun? Creepy af more like!!

    • Dubious says:

      3 Feb3 February 13:48

      How does it compare to the old NAY?
      That place had bad bad toilets!

      • The Original David says:

        3 Feb3 February 14:08

        Happily I never made it to Nanyuan, but PKX has possibly some of the best public toilets in China.

• r* says:

  3 Feb3 February 11:53

  Is it a good idea to go to china atm given their opaque covid reporting? What happens if you were to test positive somehow while you were there?

  • Rhys says:

    3 Feb3 February 12:13

    Not sure it’s issuing tourist visas just yet

  • HAN says:

    3 Feb3 February 12:20

    Most of my friends and parents got COVID in Dec and Jan after the Chinese government lifted the restrictions. And my friends who returned to China recently also got infected. If you get COVID in China right now, nobody cares to be honest. But I believe you need to be tested negative if you want to return to the UK.

    • Jonathan says:

      3 Feb3 February 12:46

      I think they’re strict on mask wearing, but yeah after the Chinese government realised that their policy of targeting Zero Covid cases was simply unfeasible and nearly impossible, they’ve apparently (bitterly) accepted that they’ll have to live with it, like just about every other country in the world

      I think there’s one or two countries in the remote Pacific Ocean that didn’t get stung by the virus

• Novice says:

  3 Feb3 February 14:40

  Would love to go China one day and tour. It’s on my list.

  A lot of people bring countries’ issues, politics etc into their opinions but I think countries shouldn’t be bashed based on the problems otherwise a person shouldn’t leave their home because every country has issues.

  I read yesterday that HK are going to be giving free flights starting in March to attract tourists.

  • Novice says:

    3 Feb3 February 14:42

    I mean a countries’ history, culture, nature, sights, food etc shouldn’t be bashed when talking about travel. Policies should be argued and protested but that has nothing to do with travelling.

    • Londonsteve says:

      4 Feb4 February 11:12

      To a point. We all have choice about where we spend our money and it’s a big world out there. We’re not obliged to travel to countries that contradict our beliefs and values and it’s an emotional decision very personal to us. Some might not be bothered whereas others would refuse to travel even if the entire trip was for free. I think it’s sometimes also hard to separate tourism from politics in so much as the latter can sometimes impede or make impossible enjoyment of the former. Speaking personally there are countries I would refuse to travel to even for free, right now Russia is one of them.

      • Jet says:

        5 Feb5 February 18:03

        When Tony Blair bring this country to Iraq war, are you going to move abroad?

        • Londonsteve says:

          5 Feb5 February 20:36

          One conflict is now, the other was 20 years ago and who knows how many elections and PMs ago. There’s also a world of difference between choosing which countries to visit versus where we live, it’s not so easy to chop and change when it comes to the latter. But since you ask, yes I’m in the process of leaving the UK, not because of Tony Blair or the Iraq war however. They don’t even figure in my decision making process.

• His Holyness says:

  3 Feb3 February 18:05

  Gitmo…

• SteveW says:

  3 Feb3 February 18:07

  Yes, can you imagine the outcry from the left wing hypocrites if it happened in a “western” country.

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