American Express brings back a minimum income requirement for its cards

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• freckles says:

  20 Jul20 July 12:03

  Few mentions about investment income maybe not being accepted by Amex. I suspect that was why Barclaycard effectively turned me down (they actually accepted but only with £200 limit).
  Financial institutions (IMO) need to update their philosophy on what constitutes income these days as many of us no longer have a DB pension, annuity, state pension etc, and the pension flexibility rules give us so many ways of using a fund with tax efficiency. E.g. for the first few years after I retired I had exactly the same income as I did when I worked, yet paid not a single penny tax due to the way I arranged withdrawals. I’ve since adapted and now draw part income subject to tax, and part investment income on a regular basis; yet as far as I can tell the credit referencing companies only use the taxed income to rate me – I’ve shown my ‘income’ as the total figure as well as using the lower figure plus £x ‘other’ income and get wildly differing results on credit rating, card availability etc.

  • BBbetter says:

    20 Jul20 July 12:36

    If you are that desperate for a card, withdraw more than the Amex limit for one year, file return and use that to apply for the card. For subsequent years, go back to your old withdrawal.
    How difficult is that?

    • Julia says:

      20 Jul20 July 13:11

      BB, I think you’ve missed the thrust of freckles’s argument, which I agree with.

      The decision makers in the finance sectors who set the tone for the rest of us are no longer in tune with today’s financially astute. The outcome is that those people who have been financially savvy enough to generate their own income to satisfy the new minimum amount but, are still under the tax threshold rate for reporting, are now being adversely treated compared to those who meet the minimum requirement but got there through earning a wage.

      It just doesn’t make sense and potentially discriminatory.

    • freckles says:

      20 Jul20 July 13:21

      I am not at all ‘desperate’ for a card – I have the right Amex and Virgin cards for my needs, without having to ‘play the system’ as you suggest. It was only BC that didn’t like the fact my ‘income’ was very low supplemented by investment withdrawals.
      And yes, as Julia has commented, you totally missed the point of my post – the financial sector is out of date with the modern retired financially astute.

      • BBbetter says:

        20 Jul20 July 15:57

        Lol, you call yourself financially astute. From Amex point of view, you have a pot of money that you can technically withdraw and spend tomorrow and you still don’t have a job.
        Just because you have set up a withdrawal plan to minimise tax, doesn’t mean it’s less risk for Amex.

        • dougzz99 says:

          20 Jul20 July 17:45

          Person could lose their job tomorrow. Someone with decent investment income no less reliable, and could equally be argued has shown greater financial acumen in building investment for income.

        • AJA says:

          20 Jul20 July 17:57

          Consider someone who holds £700k in ISAs (takes 35 years without any investment growth so very possible to achieve by the time you retire even if you only start at the age of 30). Assume the income rate is 5% – that gives them a tax-free income of £35k per annum which is the requirement for a BAPP card. That;s being very financially astute but they would be turned down by Amex. How is that risky for Amex?

  • ken says:

    20 Jul20 July 13:33

    Barclaycard have given lots of people an initial £200 limit over the last 5 years while they verify income (within 45 days).
    If you provide details of pension / drawdown / dividends etc, and everything works as it should, they will increase the limit.

• yorkieflyer says:

  20 Jul20 July 12:15

  The writing has been on the wall for a while in the credit card market with the withdrawal of cards, restrictions on churn and re applications, Amex stopping partial refunds and now this. I took the view a little while ago to sign up to cards I view as keepers prior to my retirement. Like others I’ve hogged out at the trough of churning Amex cards in particular so c’est La vie, game over!

• david says:

  20 Jul20 July 12:28

  upon upgrading from free to BAPP will it be taken into account?

  • Rob says:

    20 Jul20 July 12:55

    Yes

• BobM says:

  20 Jul20 July 13:42

  One small positive here is that the recent mysterious unwritten £50,000 income limit for the Platinum card has been reduced and firmed up.
  Some good news for those in the £35-£50k bracket anyway.

  • sloth says:

    20 Jul20 July 14:27

    There’s nothing to stop Amex temporarily increasing the minimum income requirement when they increase the SUB again… they have done it before

• freckles says:

  20 Jul20 July 13:48

  @ken, this was a year ago when HFP first SUP was announced. Yes they asked for proof and it was all supplied, but they confirmed £200 limit so it was goodbye to them.

• Ayesha says:

  20 Jul20 July 14:21

  Any idea what the minimum requirement is for centurion card?

  • Rhys says:

    20 Jul20 July 14:28

    https://www.headforpoints.com/2022/09/23/american-express-centurion-card-uk-benefits/

    • Justin says:

      20 Jul20 July 16:11

      It appears you posted that article in 2022 with the following: “It is not clear if there is an income requirement.”

      As a minimum requirement for other cards have been (re)introduced, I do also wonder if this would be the case for any invited Centurion applicants… whether it be for the personal and/or business variant.

      • Rhys says:

        20 Jul20 July 16:40

        Why bother. Centurion cards appear to be issued on a case-by-case basis. Amex will be looking at a whole lot more than just income. Overall spend, type of spend etc will be just as influential.

        • Roy says:

          20 Jul20 July 21:50

          Of course you can qualify for a Centurion card by being a super duper big spender, but an awful lot of them are issued via partnerships with private banks. AIUI in such agreements you pledge the investments held with the private bank as collateral should you default, so it’s a completely different business model.

        • Justin says:

          21 Jul21 July 00:59

          My statement was for the benefit of the original poster as your reply had no context and was just simply a link that seemed to be lazily posted… and after reading it, the query was not answered. I don’t mean to offend, but those types of responses are a pet peeve of mine.

          Anyways, as your most recent reply still doesn’t answer the original query, it seems to be clear there is no certainty to whether there is/isn’t a minimum requirement at this time. We can all speculate, but it’s always nice to have a definitive answer.

• HertsSam says:

  20 Jul20 July 14:51

  For those of you complaining about not being able to show a sufficient income but havng the necessary funds, would you be prepared to give Amex open banking access to your main current account? For verification purposes only.
  There was a thread on MSE yesterday, which can’t find today, where the poster complained he had given another financialy institution open banking access to his bank/current account and the 2nd financial institution was ‘data mining’.
  Replying posters said he had given access and the account access was for data verification
  I don’t know if Amex will ever do this, but it is certainly a possibility.

  • Rui N. says:

    20 Jul20 July 14:52

    Barclays does that.

  • Julia says:

    20 Jul20 July 16:43

    No.

• Peter says:

  20 Jul20 July 15:54

  Rob – anyone who’s had a 25% salary increase since 2016 is very likely in the minority!

  • Rob says:

    20 Jul20 July 16:13

    Bank of England calculator shows inflation has been 30.6% between June 2016 and June 2023. You’d therefore have had a 30% pay rise, assuming your employer had kept your raises in line with inflation. If you had been promoted or had any other skill-related rise you’d have had well over 30%.

    • Peter K says:

      20 Jul20 July 17:46

      That’s a big assumption. I’ve just checked and in my profession there’s been a typically 10-20% increase in chargeable fees over that time period.
      I’m lucky that I’m in a niche of that where it’s much higher, but most of the country isn’t.

      I’m sure my profession isn’t the only one. That’s why there is so much talk of a squeeze on finances for many.

      • Rui N. says:

        20 Jul20 July 18:48

        The higher energy costs and high interest rate environmental also led lots of companies to actually decrease the average level of salary increase in the past 2 pay reviews. Know several people in the biotech sector where that has happened.

    • yorkieflyer says:

      20 Jul20 July 18:35

      oh dear Rob I’m afraid the whole public sector hasn’t been as fortunate as I’m sure you would know if you asked a consultant today? Not that I’m too worried about those poor dears in paticular as I’m sure their private earnings have kept the wolf from the door.

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