BIG NEWS: BA moves to revenue-based tier status for Bronze, Silver, Gold and Gold Guest List

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• Nick P says:

  16 Jan16 January 11:39

  Perhaps it’s worth flagging that a single parent with children is probably unable to book a holiday as an individual [and claim all the tier points] and then book their children separately because children are unable to travel on their own.

  • Ilou says:

    16 Jan16 January 12:59

    Hopefully BA will come to their senses at least on this one !

    • RC says:

      16 Jan16 January 14:17

      If only!
      This is the airline equivalent of Brexit. Whatever your views it’s looking; divisive; badly thought through; badly planned/‘war gamed’; arrogantly set out in the belief others will follow (Lufthansa wont); and likely to see others take advantage (Air France so far).

      For a single parent can I suggest looking at Jet2 holidays? They have a great range of high end hotels in ‘indulgent escapes’, and the on the ground support is really good. Prices more competitive than BA. You can still pay with Amex to get Avios.
      Alternatively, hotels a can often discount by meaningful amounts if you book direct.

      • Ironside says:

        16 Jan16 January 16:22

        …and, in hindsight, only a tiny minority of the population will consider that it was worth doing in the first place.

        Yep, just like Brexit.

        (Also yep: Jet2)

• Andrew J says:

  16 Jan16 January 15:13

  A survey has just gone out to members asking what they think of the programme – sounds like they are open to listening and rethinking things.

  • Rob says:

    16 Jan16 January 15:22

    Don’t think so.

    I am expecting a change of policy on soft landings to be announced any day now but I don’t see much wiggling elsewhere. That said, booking trends post 1st April should be looking clearer now.

    • Andrew J says:

      16 Jan16 January 15:33

      Oh well, I made my feelings quite clear in my survey responses, so that made me feel better! And that’s good news about soft landings at least.

      • Tom says:

        16 Jan16 January 15:47

        The only hard news we’ve had on ‘soft landings’ direct from BA is that they didn’t intend to change the policy.
        Too much doom and gloom and chatter about this 🙁

        • BA Flyer IHG Stayer says:

          16 Jan16 January 15:57

          The chatter and “doom and gloom” about the removal of soft landings wouldn’t have existed if BA had been clear on their policy from the get go or stepped in PDQ to clarify.

        • Rob says:

          16 Jan16 January 16:33

          That’s not true. They were to be removed. I have been told this multiple times now.

    • Phil says:

      16 Jan16 January 16:19

      Aren’t Feb and May market announcement times so any changes more likely either April or May?
      Or does it not matter?

      • JDB says:

        16 Jan16 January 16:46

        It’s not a market sensitive issue that would need to be reported for regulatory reasons, so this could be announced at any time without any formal notification. While there are set times published in advance when IAG makes results announcements etc. to the market, it can also make additional announcements formally via RNS or a simple media release or something much less formal at any time as required.

        • RC says:

          16 Jan16 January 17:01

          I think you misunderstood what ‘material’ means to the LSE.
          Though this is the same IAG that tried to keep it quiet (unsuccessfully) when its senior investor relations manager Andrew Barker was convicted and jailed for offences I won’t even repeat here.

        • Phil says:

          16 Jan16 January 18:58

          Doesn’t need to be market sensitive but they won’t want to spook investors by announcing things just before those dates and there will be a focus on year end, etc… by execs and not rocking that boat.

          You are talking to someone who works in financial services. You don’t have to be causing RNS alert to hold off things during that time.
          They are called change freezes and quite common around close period for businesses

    • NorthernLass says:

      16 Jan16 January 16:53

      Do you mean a change on policy which is bad news?!

      • NorthernLass says:

        16 Jan16 January 16:55

        Sorry, should have read the whole convo. So yes then.

      • JDB says:

        16 Jan16 January 18:06

        @Northern Lass – the threshold for a company to need to issue an RNS statement to the stock exchanges where they listed is relatively high, and companies are very acutely aware of when they do or don’t need to issue such statements. With the exception of almost daily RNS statements in respect of its share buyback programme and resultant voting rights, I don’t think IAG has issued any RNS since its Q3 results on 8 November.

        The changes to Tier Point collection aren’t even close to needing announcement, let alone soft landings.

        • Phil says:

          16 Jan16 January 19:00

          We are not talking RNS trigger you have got the wrong end of the stick again just like last time you began talking RNS when that wasn’t remotely involved

      • Phil says:

        16 Jan16 January 19:06

        RNS is news that is officially released to market and disseminated across a service to dealing desks.

        This doesn’t have to be you just don’t actively make changes to things around your end of year results / Q1 announcements.

        Staff with shares can be blocked from dealing in them during what is known as the closed period so as to avoid prior knowledge influencing trading.

        • patrick says:

          16 Jan16 January 20:25

          I find the suggestion that JDB is incorrect about anything whatsoever highly offensive. What would Mrs. Thatcher say?

    • LittleNick says:

      16 Jan16 January 17:10

      Do you think IB will be following suit to the way members earn EP on their scheme Rob?

      • Rob says:

        16 Jan16 January 19:50

        You would assume so but Spain is a totally different market.

  • GUWonder says:

    17 Jan17 January 02:45

    It’s the smoke and mirrors dog and pony show meant to fool gullible customers into believing BA cares about customer opinions. BA cares about money, and that’s what these elite status qualification chances are all about. It’s also behind the consideration to eliminate elite status soft landings.

    • JDB says:

      17 Jan17 January 07:24

      Isn’t money what most big corporations care about? As a shareholder in many companies, I would be quite annoyed if they didn’t. Directors have a fiduciary duty to act in the best interests of the company and its shareholders.

      • Phil says:

        17 Jan17 January 07:57

        Not entirely as there are a number of metrics that are measured.
        If it was just about bumping shareprice all companies would just do buybacks all day long and blow their cash shortterm.

        That is also why investing money in the company is seen as a longterm positive.

        If a company makes a massive profit but hits negative headlines it is also damaging. Same if polling of pax is negative and loss of loyal purchasers is same as losing a longterm contract in other spheres

        • JDB says:

          17 Jan17 January 09:00

          @Phil – Ryanair seems to do quite well while constantly attracting negative publicity. It’s very common, and has been for years, for European airlines to have poor reputations in their home markets.

          In terms of the BA tier point changes, do you think analysts should be adjusting their IAG forecasts downwards? What do you think the net impact will be on passenger numbers/profitability?

      • Richie says:

        17 Jan17 January 08:41

        @JDB are you a shareholder in HAL and IAG?

        • JDB says:

          17 Jan17 January 08:53

          @Richie – haha! I am close to both for different reasons which absolutely don’t mean I need to nice about them. I am close also to a few non IAG airlines and other airport operators.

          HAL has a very short shareholder list which is public information so it’s clear I’m not one of those. I don’t hold shares in IAG or indeed any airline stock as they are a crap investment except maybe for trading and I’m not interested in short term trading.

        • Phil says:

          17 Jan17 January 13:42

          @JDB – RyanAir do well because they have a constant stream of people due to being the entirely cheapest with zero interest in customer service but that is their known status.

          BA trade on the idea they are above that level and so are not the cheapest option in a great many cases.

          Short-term probably, long-term definitely as cost-cutting has savaged the brand power and disruptions to loyalty, leisure spend in major economies and business spend are all key factors.

          Analysts will be noting the loyalty changes.

          This is personal opinion and does not constitute trading advice or analysis. YMMV

    • Rob says:

      17 Jan17 January 07:34

      We think they are caving in on soft landings.

      • Phil says:

        17 Jan17 January 08:03

        Is this going to be one of those hidden climbdoens as they made no statement either way.
        If announced after April they are binning it all hell would break loose as folks would feel more deceived

• Stone de Croze says:

  16 Jan16 January 18:13

  FWIW I will be staying with BAC for now.

  Under the current system I’m a natural silver, occasional accidental gold member. My flight pattern is heavily based on LGW (am based in Guernsey) but frequently have to trek to LHR for long hauls. Historically I have preferred BA/Oneworld – e.g. flying BA LHR-DXB when EK LGW-DXB would have been easier and even cheaper overall. I do like BA’s SH network from LHR but most UK and European destinations I travel to can be easily reached ex-LGW on reputable LCCs.

  I will be staying with BAC because I am an avid Avios collector and can get best value from Amex companion vouchers. However I will not be chasing status under any circumstances and will always now prefer the flight which presents the best balance between fit and price, no matter the airline. I expect my points balances in Skyteam (Virgin) and *A (Aeroplan) may tick along rather faster now and I look forward to redemption opportunities there.

  IF KLM still had a base at LGW I would probably have been tempted over to Flying Blue (as a hop over to AMS is not really more difficult than National Express to T5) – but they don’t so I won’t. I’ll wait to see what happens with BAC and indeed other programs and stay put for now.

  • Richie says:

    16 Jan16 January 20:07

    BTW you can fly from Guernsey to Southampton and then KLM Southampton to Amsterdam.

    • Throwawayname says:

      16 Jan16 January 21:44

      I’ve never been to Guernsey, but the airport wiki says that Aurigny fly straight to CDG!

      • Stone de Croze says:

        17 Jan17 January 12:51

        Yes – twice a week at the moment. I wouldn’t want to bet a long haul connection that any itinerary relying on that link won’t be scuppered by fog or tech delays. Southampton does have the frequency though and the KLM flights seem nicely timed – so that could work. Food for thought!

  • yonasl says:

    17 Jan17 January 07:53

    It is now very hard to earn both avios and status with BA flights (when you are not silver/gold anymore you will earn even less avios with flights).

    So what you are saying is that you will keep earning avios (credit card mostly) and use that. But you are already exploring using other companies as there is no incentive to pay more to BA.

    I get the new system incentivises to pay BA. I don’t get how they incentivise you to keep using BA. Most SH flights are now useless towards status (even in business class).

• Adam says:

  17 Jan17 January 09:56

  There’s an ambiguity/small loophole in BA’s new rules. The FAQs state that any eligible add-on means that the entire cost counts towards tier points. Does this mean that the simple act of paying for a seat or adding a heavier bag would ensure that the full cost would count? FAQ pasted below.

  “When you book a flight, eligible spend includes the base fare and the Carrier Imposed Charges (YQ and YR), but not the non-airline taxes and fees. You can find the price breakdown of your ticket on the “Flight Summary” page before confirming your booking or on the booking confirmation email (e-ticket receipt).

  When you book a British Airways Holidays package or buy any eligible add-ons (seat selection, additional baggage or cabin upgrades) your eligible spend will be the full amount spent.”

  • yonasl says:

    17 Jan17 January 11:32

    I think they mean the “full amount spent” on that transaction. So indeed on an BAH the full amount is flights + hotels/cars (including the taxes). In the case of a seat it is the seat price (including the taxes). No loophole to add taxes/fees to a flight only booking (you will get the base fare + carrier charges + any additional add on fully).

    • Adam says:

      17 Jan17 January 12:03

      Hmmm… I preferred my hope more, though it seemed widely improbably.

      So, then, if one books (as I have) a flight plus hotel but not explicitly something packaged as a BA Holiday does the inclusion of the hotel mean that the ‘full amount spent’ is counted towards tier points or only the ‘base’ flight fee plus the hotel? To my disappointment, I was required to pay the full amount on booking rather than the usual x% deposit that an actual BA Holiday requires.

      They need a proper copywriter on this stuff, it’s as leaky as a sieve.

      • Jonally says:

        17 Jan17 January 12:41

        I was also looking at booking a (multi-city) flight then adding a hotel. I just noticed this in the FAQs about holidays:

        “You must book through the Flight + Hotel or Flight + Car option and add the individual British Airways Club number for each Member prior to travel to earn Tier Points for your British Airways Holidays package.”

        I am pretty sure under the old BAH double tier point scheme it didn’t matter how you booked as long as a car or hotel were included. Anyway, I won’t be booking with BA as the flight (San Antonio in Premium Economy) is £500 cheaper with AA.

        • Adam says:

          17 Jan17 January 12:50

          Oh, cobblers. The reason my booking flow was flight and then add the hotel later was because flight+hotel proposed some £14k ‘options’, plus the method of selecting flights when booking a BA Holiday is horrible.

          Well, then I guess the inconsistency in BA’s consistently hopeless FAQs will almost certainly work not in my favour. The swine!

• Garethgerry says:

  17 Jan17 January 10:01

  I don’t understand all the whinging, when I was flying regularly for business, CE return to Europe , Germany, France , Belgium, Italy , Spain , Netherlands was 80 pts return . So needed 10 returns for Silver. I exp 10 CE returns would also nowadays get you silver.

  The tier points regime , silver for a few well chosen flights was a temporary aberration , a bit like 1% interest rates. It’s over, just think yourself lucky to have benefited from it.

  • Adam says:

    17 Jan17 January 10:25

    Not even half-way, would be my estimate.

    • Rob says:

      17 Jan17 January 11:20

      If your average flight is £500 return in CE (£400 pre tax) you’d need 19 returns to hit Silver. Before you needed 8.

  • babyg_wc says:

    17 Jan17 January 10:27

    @Garethgerry – in your first paragraph you say what’s all the whinging about, and state you only need 2 extra CE return flights vs the old system to gain status (sure if you youre happy to pay £4-500 each way for a CE ticket i guess to get the 7500tps needed), and then you say almost the opposite in your last paragraph… not really sure what point you’re trying to make?

  • Ziggy says:

    17 Jan17 January 11:01

    Ah yes, the “it was harder in the old days so there’s no reason for it to be any easier now” argument.

    Based on this method of thinking, someone who was flying in the 70s (when there wasn’t any kind of FFP) could point out that if BA did away with BAEC/BAC completely no one should complain at all (insert eye-roll emoji).

    That nonsensical thought process aside, your maths doesn’t appear to stack up.

    You would have to pay over £750 per roundtrip CE booking if 10 trips were to earn you BAC Silver, and if you’ve been keeping up with the times, you’ll know that most roundtrip CE bookings don’t cost anywhere near that figure.

  • Throwawayname says:

    17 Jan17 January 13:17

    Whenever I have checked the IAG route that would be of most interest to me (I2 from MAN), it seems to be £150-190 each way in business. Taxes and charges are about £65 for a return, so let’s say it’s £120 eligible spend per segment. 10 returns wouldn’t even get you a BA bronze card.

    • planeconcorde says:

      17 Jan17 January 23:27

      I currently need 8 CE returns to get Silver. On the short route I fly the most, on the average fare ex taxed, I need 42 returns on the new system. That’s not going to happen.

    • Tom says:

      18 Jan18 January 09:04

      I booked CE EDI to LCY return in Feb last night for £198 return!

• RC says:

  17 Jan17 January 12:22

  Soft landings would be a massive climb down. Here’s why.
  This wasn’t a direct cost cutting exercise. City chatter which therefore will have come from IAG is that this was a sizeable revenue grab. Why?
  Without soft landing status then customers in main cabin will be forced to pay for what they previously enjoyed for free., so seats at least. Then with the much vaunted new app (if it works) other things might be sold, like fast track, lounge access, a wheelie carry on (when BA cracks down on HBO carry on limits)..
  Soft landings kill or at least delay that opportunity.
  It seems the plethora status matches genuinely has BA spooked and panicked. Though it’s incredulous that BA was clearly arrogant enough not to have anticipated that. If that’s correct it’s astonishing that BA management haven’t been able to envisage the permutations of the ‘chess pieces’ several moves ahead.
  Soft landings will be a massive climb down from the plan.

  • Phil says:

    17 Jan17 January 13:47

    They overvalue their offering and have done for a while

  • JDB says:

    17 Jan17 January 14:00

    It seems bizarre to suggest that some hypothetical like the removal of soft landings might represent a “massive climbdow”. BA has said absolutely nothing official for years, but recently, to test the waters has whispered in a few ears that they are likely to be removed and left people to guess when. They have quite deliberately kept the ambiguity/optionality until such time as they feel they need to make a decision, reportedly imminent. It can honestly be presented as further clarification of last month’s announcement.

    In order to maintain the momentum of the cull, they should say you will be OK this April, not in April 2026 but intended to continue thereafter as those will earned on the new basis.

    • RC says:

      17 Jan17 January 14:36

      Not invoking the spirit of Thatcher yet?
      This seems to be a change exactly against the benefits (for it) that IAG has been spinning as a revenue opportunity for selling ancillary items.
      Soft landing nixes that so indeed it’s a massive climb down. It’s a huge ‘opportunity cost’ in present value terms.
      I appreciate financial aspects are beyond the grasp of your comments as previously you’ve sought to deflect from these or gaslight, but other readers will make up their own minds here.

      • Dubious says:

        18 Jan18 January 10:34

        “Soft landing nixes that […] It’s a huge ‘opportunity cost’ in present value terms.”
        The *opportunity* to selling ancillary items and services only arises if you have customers…

    • Phil says:

      17 Jan17 January 18:25

      I’m sorry @JDB but this seems completely at odds with reality

    • Tom says:

      18 Jan18 January 09:14

      Agreed, sounds like it’s not BA that’s ‘spooked and panicking’. I have a message from BA that there is no intention to change policy on soft landings and for me that’s preferable to all the Chinese whispers on here!
      Agree that something should be in the FAQs but quite likely they have not decided yet and as JDB says it’s Apr 26 that is the key date, but customers need to know in terms of requalification in 25/26, or not

  • Kaye says:

    17 Jan17 January 14:05

    It’s incredibly back to front to reality.

    They’ve sat there and thought ‘wow everyone loves paying for our club cabins and are happy to pay for status. They should pay more to access our wonderful services.’

    When the reality is because status was attainable, people were collectively turning a blind eye to how poor the service offering is.

    Corporate arrogance in a nutshell.

    • Rob says:

      17 Jan17 January 14:13

      Bingo.

      This is my view. Let’s assume people fly 1 longhaul for every 3 shorthaul. People would fly BA longhaul – accepting a poorer experience than other carriers – because it got them lounge access on shorthaul. Very, very few business travellers can book CE on short haul even if they get J for longhaul.

      Make it impossible to earn status and BA loses both bits of business but for different reasons – it loses long haul because, when not chasing status, there are better options and it loses short haul because the ability for fast track and lounge is gone.

      The other thing not being discussed is that even high spending passengers may move. Let’s assume I travel to NY monthly and my employer spends £10k on a fully flex ticket and I can choose my airline.

      At present, I still need to put 6 of these trips to BA to lock in my Gold, which makes my short haul palatable. Perhaps the other 6 I might move to VS. Going forward, I only need to put 2 of my £10k long hauls to BA to guarantee my Gold. My other 10 £10k flights can go to other airlines. BA could even lose money from the sort of passenger it covets.

      • vlcnc says:

        17 Jan17 January 14:35

        Well summarised!

      • Mighty Hunter says:

        17 Jan17 January 14:52

        Sounds spot on to me.
        Which begs the question, how much have BA paid McKinsey for damaging advice when they could get the good stuff from Rob for free?

        • No longer Entitled says:

          18 Jan18 January 10:59

          This is why with consultants, if you attach any value to them whatsoever, it is to help define how you implement policy. If you are hiring them to dictate policy you really shouldn’t be in the job.

      • RC says:

        17 Jan17 January 14:53

        Well put.
        That described exact the way employees try to break travel policy to keep their status. For example, preferred carrier is United so employees suddenly’have’ to start US work trips in Philadelphia or San Diego instead on NY or LA, which forces travel into BA.
        If there’s no upside to doing that (status for leisure travel), how many are going to risk being named and shamed in internal exception reports to management?
        We’re going to find out, that’s for sure.
        I still predict this will end up like the AA/Vasu Raja episode, so Colm Lacy has bet his career on this. Any climb down on soft landings will be his attempt to avoid such an outcome. (Though @JDB will be along shortly to defend the indefensible again and tell us all how lucky we all are to be allowed to pay BA for its mediocre regularly late flights).

      • Andrew J says:

        17 Jan17 January 15:25

        Totally agree with this analysis. In years to come this will be used as a case study of what not to do when running a business.

        • RC says:

          17 Jan17 January 22:05

          And how not to communicate it

      • sigma421 says:

        17 Jan17 January 15:59

        How many people who were previously just going to ba.com to book a flight when they were going to travel and didn’t even know what the competition cost are now at least going to be checking other options. The whole point of the Executive Club was to lock in that sort of blind behaviour.

      • GUWonder says:

        17 Jan17 January 16:00

        That’s a very good point. Before the US3 shifted their programs to be big spender programs more than frequent segment/distance flyers, most of the high-fare premium cabin travelers in my social circle had top tier status in one program and only one program and maybe low tier status in another program. After the change to revenue-based status, many of these same people or their successors have top-tier and top-spender status in two or more US airline programs. The consequence is that the loyalty program has somewhat less influence on their purchase decisions because they more easily have multiple top and/or mid-tier elite status across more airlines/alliances and thus are less likely to stick to one airline and/or alliance than they used to do with pretty much the same kind of travel needs now as before.

        As someone with mid or top-tier status in each of the big 3 alliances and generally with at least two program in each alliance, the loyalty programs have little to no influence in my purchase plans for economy class travel. And they have even less influence for my purchase plans for premium class travel unless it has to do with an achievable elite status target for me to keep the playing field level between the various competing airlines.

      • Ken says:

        17 Jan17 January 17:10

        Going west are BA really that much different than the US carriers ?

        Going east I suspect BA attracts business because they are flying direct.
        The fact that you could get 560 points flying to Asia using another carrier always seemed against BAs commercial interests

        • Ziggy says:

          17 Jan17 January 18:01

          @Ken I’d say that going west, BA are probably behind American Airlines as the better choice for a lot of OneWorld elites booking J thanks to (a) the better lounges in T3, (b) the fact that you’re guaranteed a good Business Class seat and don’t run the risk of getting stuck in a relic from the 90s and (c) you don’t have to risk the frequent A380 issues that BA can’t seem to get away from.

          Of course, by flying with AA you’re still handing over money to BA (courtesy of the TATL JV) and you run the risk of having to endure a cabin crew who would rather be anywhere but the aircraft they’re working on, but neither is a particularly compelling reason to avoid AA given what I mentioned in the first paragraph.

      • Phil says:

        17 Jan17 January 18:33

        I trudge down to LHR / fly down from MAN / BHX because status made LHR departures overseas worthwhile.
        However I am increasingly using Emirates and now can choose to just to fly straight from MAN and save the connection.

        There is no BA lounge in many regionals and so without status dangled why would you trudge to LHR?

        I fly J and F mostly but do some Y to Europe shorthaul.
        I can save a packet and go EZY and put the save towards Emirates for going East and AF or others going West with nicer experience

      • David Jones says:

        18 Jan18 January 08:49

        I am good example of another consequence of this change on higher-spending passengers. I am GGL and fly at least once a month to the US for work in business class and expect to be able to retain GGL in the new scheme.

        I am currently about a year away from GfL. With these changes, GfL is probably two to three years away. Once I reached GfL, my plan had been to keep flying with BA and OW at the same rate because GGLfL – while a bit of a stretch – might just be achievable if I kept up this flying pattern for the next 10-15 years. With the new spend based tier points, GGLfL would be 25-30 years away. I have no chance of making it. I would definitely have retired by then, and there’s a reasonable chance I’d be dead!

        I already do sufficient flights with VS each year to make Gold with them. Once I’ve reached GfL, there is no incentive for me to do any more flights with BA than the amount I need each year to renew GGL. I might therefore be tempted to fly UA a few times a year and see if I can get status with them. And certainly I’d be more likely to look outside BA and OW for leisure travel – I’ve never flown with EK or SQ on holiday, for example, and that’s entirely down to chasing tier points with BA.

        One other point. I also think this will have a big impact on my Club Europe flying. Pretty much all of my European leisure and work trips are in Club Europe. In fact, whenever we decide to go away for a weekend break in Europe, we just book BA Club Europe without even looking at other airlines. But now that a Club Europe flight will typically earn me between 200 and 400 nTPs, that’s going to have far less impact on me renewing GGL or making GfL than the old TPs. I’m now much more likely to shop around on short haul – sometimes still flying BA, but also trying out other airlines on routes where it makes sense.

      • AJA says:

        18 Jan18 January 12:41

        @Rob I get what you are saying. Those who predominantly fly shorthaul are the ones most impacted by this. And the business flyer who is flying on company dime at £10k per throw will definitely gain/retain status much more easily. But I question if they will actually move to VS. Previously they needed to do 6 flights via BA only to get Gold but now if they do 7 the same they get GGL and going forward they only need 5 flights to retain GGL. Why would they not aim for that, especially if someone else is paying? After that I agree they might go with another airline. On the other hand what is the point of having status with any airline if you then don’t fly them once you have it?

      • Tom says:

        19 Jan19 January 10:02

        Something I rarely see commented on is that BA’s short haul offering from London is actually quite competitive.

        I travel to Europe a few times a year, generally to major cities. The LCCs barely undercut BA once a proper carry-on is factored in, plus the hassle of Stansted/Luton compared to LHR/LCY, and generally worse flight times for business travel.

        My long haul flying is almost all for work and entirely TATL. I think this pattern is common. Given BA’s competitive SH offering and general dearth of better options TATL, I don’t see BA club changes making any difference to my flying choices, and I suspect my travel pattern is fairly typical.

    • GUWonder says:

      17 Jan17 January 15:49

      Exactly. Elite status benefits make people ignore or downplay competition and sub-standard service delivery. But strip away those status benefits or make the status benefits much more costly? Then people start shopping by schedule, price and perceived reliability and quality of service. BA doesn’t look great on most of those fronts if you’re not a London origin/destination traveler.

      • RC says:

        17 Jan17 January 16:08

        It’s not great even from London. Weaker schedule/frequency apart from club Jed holiday spots. So just the reverse of what’s needed to keep the high yield customers. It’s like one bit of BA doesn’t talk to the other bit.

      • Phil says:

        17 Jan17 January 18:35

        And if you feel aggrieved BA also has a black mark in any calcs of who to go with too

  • GUWonder says:

    17 Jan17 January 15:41

    Given what I know of various contract lounge negotiations and agreements with airlines over the years and more recently, it’s a pretty safe assumption that BA too has or will soon see a increase in contract lounge costs. But the big play with such a change is to get more seat fees, baggage fees and cabin buy-up revenue out of a bigger proportion of its frequent flyer base. And the way to do this is to gut the elite status rolls and make people pay more for elite status.

    • CheshirePete says:

      17 Jan17 January 15:49

      This is so spot on. When I spent some time working for BAEC it was encouraged to try and sell seats especially. You get some PRP anyhow for it. However, working on the Gold Line 99% of the time, it was obviously like trying to sell sand to someone who lives in a desert……!

      • Scott says:

        18 Jan18 January 15:44

        If the new app actually works, some upsetting might be possible.

        I wonder how many missed opportunities there are from upselling to people flying say MAN-LHR-JFK? No offers made for routes such as that, and it’s very possible that Joe Bloggs and his wife may be happy paying say £200 each to upgrade from Y to PE.

        Seat selling wise, depends on the cabin. No really bad seats club suites wise.
        Economy and PE. Wouldn’t want a middle seat, buy whether I’d pay say £80 for a seat, I don’t know (won’t pay on Finnair when they try to charge whatever it is for an exit row).
        Ryanair. Many won’t pay £8 or so to sit in an specific seat especially when the fare is a decent price (I paid £8.50 for a bog standard window seat in just over a week)

        • Scott says:

          18 Jan18 January 15:46

          Upselling rather than upsetting….auto correct 🙁

• SteveCroydon says:

  17 Jan17 January 12:55

  Ha ha, RFF have finally caught on to these changes. Only 18 days after they were announced!!

• Nick says:

  17 Jan17 January 15:39

  Just got a BA ‘ We value your opinion’ survey land in my inbox. Quite extensive and obviously based around future spend, BAEC opinion etc.

  Wonder if they’re getting jittery.

  For reference I’m the 10/12 Club Europe flights and 1/2 Club World flights per annum BA business customer who would scrape Gold each year and now can look forward to Silver with little benefit over what I get booking Club anyway.

  • Andrew J says:

    17 Jan17 January 16:25

    I got the same survey yesterday, and telling them exactly what I thought made me feel better.

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