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I booked 2 award tickets with 241 voucher back in 2020 for traveling in 2021. The flight was cancelled so I rebooked a flight in 2021 for traveling in 2022. But it was first downgraded without notice then cancelled again by BA. The 241 voucher used to book the flight has expired. I call BA they said I am not able to rebook. I can only get a refund for the points and tax.The voucher will be expired. Is there anything can I do to rebook a flight in 2023? Or is there a way to extend my 241 voucher? Many thanks
If BA has cancelled your flight you are entitled to re-routing exactly the same as last time so don’t accept a refund unless that’s actually what you want (with expired 241). Try calling again as a different CSA may well be better informed about your rights, but failing this you may have to go to CEDR/MCOL. Recent reports suggest that BA are being much more reasonable about re-routing these days though, so it’s worth having another go.
I’ve seen reports (and indeed loses at CEDR reported on here) that BA won’t rebook past ticket vadility. Which in this case is likely 1yr from the date you rebooked last time. However that isn’t your UK/EU right, you have the right to rebook at your convenience but you’d need to be prepared to fight it at MCOL
If you want to fly the same dates in 2022 then they’ll need to reroute you and as NorthernLass says there are more options for that now, if you tell us the route we could advise
If BA has cancelled your flight you are entitled to re-routing exactly the same as last time so don’t accept a refund unless that’s actually what you want (with expired 241). Try calling again as a different CSA may well be better informed about your rights, but failing this you may have to go to CEDR/MCOL. Recent reports suggest that BA are being much more reasonable about re-routing these days though, so it’s worth having another go.
Called BA again. They refused to rebook or extend the 241 voucher. They would only refund the points and tax. If I go to CEDR/MCOL what can I ask for?
- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
I’ve seen reports (and indeed loses at CEDR reported on here) that BA won’t rebook past ticket vadility. Which in this case is likely 1yr from the date you rebooked last time. However that isn’t your UK/EU right, you have the right to rebook at your convenience but you’d need to be prepared to fight it at MCOL
If you want to fly the same dates in 2022 then they’ll need to reroute you and as NorthernLass says there are more options for that now, if you tell us the route we could advise
My flight was from London to Beijing in July. There’s no direct flight at the moment. So I was planing to rebook for 2023.
- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
It would be a safer bet for you to book an indirect flight near to your original travel date and claim back the costs from BA than to try and push it much further out – as mentioned there have been some losses at CEDR re this*. Did you ask to be passed to a supervisor when you called again (and have your alternative ready to put to them? The CAA has put out very clear instructions recently that airlines MUST rebook passengers whose flights they cancel, even if it’s on a rival airline.
*I’m not saying you’re not entitled to travel at your convenience, just that this doesn’t seem to have been legally set in stone yet so is risky.
It would be a safer bet for you to book an indirect flight near to your original travel date and claim back the costs from BA than to try and push it much further out – as mentioned there have been some losses at CEDR re this*. Did you ask to be passed to a supervisor when you called again (and have your alternative ready to put to them? The CAA has put out very clear instructions recently that airlines MUST rebook passengers whose flights they cancel, even if it’s on a rival airline.
*I’m not saying you’re not entitled to travel at your convenience, just that this doesn’t seem to have been legally set in stone yet so is risky.
After 18 years it’s unlikely to be set in stone as the point is that there needs to be flexibility to adapt to the specific circumstances of each case.
BA’s standard position at CEDR/MCOL is that the statute doesn’t require the airline to hold a ticket open for the passenger indefinitely which must, in essence, be correct. They then seek to rely on the conditions of carriage and ticket validity. The judge/arbitrator has to consider the facts and make a determination. I think that for endlessly cancelled bookings to countries like Japan and China which are essentially closed, there will be some sympathy for the airlines as it might not be considered reasonable for them to be expected to hold tickets open indefinitely until the countries reopen.
It would be a safer bet for you to book an indirect flight near to your original travel date and claim back the costs from BA than to try and push it much further out – as mentioned there have been some losses at CEDR re this*. Did you ask to be passed to a supervisor when you called again (and have your alternative ready to put to them? The CAA has put out very clear instructions recently that airlines MUST rebook passengers whose flights they cancel, even if it’s on a rival airline.
My original travel date has already passed. A 1st class return flight from London to Beijing available at the moment costs £34,382. It takes 3 stops 41hr50min… I wouldn’t be able to travel on that with kids.
I spoke to the BA First team yesterday. The agent checked with his supervisor and told me they are not able to rebook any flight. Today I spoke to BA Executive club team. I asked the agent to book me for alternative airlines for traveling this month. I was told there’s no available flight. And they can’t book me for flight in 2023. The only option is to get a refund for the points and tax and loss my voucher
I think such a complicated alternative itinerary would support you in a claim for moving your travel dates to next year.
Echoing @meta and @LL on other posts, I suggest your next step should be to send a letter to BA’s legal dept detailing all of this and asking them to re-book you on to your preferred travel date (e.g, within 28 days), or face legal action. If you have a look through some of the cancellation-themed threads on this site there’s a lot more info on this process that you may find helpful.
I’d disagree with @JDB especially if you can travel around original dates. There are many categories of people that can still travel to China and recently they cut the quarantine to 10 days (7 in gov facility and 3 at home). Japan also allows a lot of people in under special circumstances. Of course all Chinese citizens are allowed to return and Japanese citizens can travel freely back and forth. So there is no reason why BA wouldn’t be able to rebook around original dates.
I would actually play them at their own game and send them a letter before action demanding re-route on original or around those dates. Specify that otherwise you’ll be rebooking yourself to the tune of £xxx and you’ll be seeking these costs via MCOL. I’d then book a flexible ticket (you might want to split the claim into two to keep it under £10k each to be able to submit the claim online) and seek recovery at MCOL. Don’t under any circumstance go to CEDR, they are useless and often side with airlines. Don’t request a refund from BA either.
@meta the OP says the original travel date has already passed, was in July. You are certainly making a big call with someone else’s money to put up say £15k+ to buy tickets and £455 court fees for each claim of £5-10k. This also in the context that getting F Avios seats to Beijing was never a problem before Covid. We used to go twice a year and never booked T-355.
Didn’t someone go to MCOL or similar recently and ask for BA to pay for new tickets? If the OP now doesn’t now want to travel until next year this might be a more realistic option. Apologies if I’ve misremembered the detail. I don’t think it’s the avios availability that’s the issue here, it’s that OP would lose the companion voucher if they accepted a refund.
Didn’t someone go to MCOL or similar recently and ask for BA to pay for new tickets? If the OP now doesn’t now want to travel until next year this might be a more realistic option. Apologies if I’ve misremembered the detail. I don’t think it’s the avios availability that’s the issue here, it’s that OP would lose the companion voucher if they accepted a refund.
Yes, the main point is the companion voucher. My preference is to rebook for 2023. I would like to claim my right to rebook which BA refused to honour.
- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
I’d agree with NorthernLass and meta. Follow the procedure start with LBA.
Of course I’m assming you have found routings on other airlines for the dates you need to travel, ie that flights do exist.
You are lucky as you seem to be in a category still admitted to China which helps a lot. Given the multiple cancellations you’ve suffered from BA when you allowed them to rebook you with a delay suiting their own availability of flights when you were ready and would have preferred and been allowed to travel much earlier, I think you’re reasonable to say to BA that you can’t delay any more and need them to provide the travel departing x and landing y, flexible on routing in between, that you purchased, asap or for your dates.
So what if BA do their own sums and find it’s £34k too. They either hand you £34k, if you’ve got a way to make a booking either by paying for it, on credit, or finding a friendly travel agent (eg major, corporate or ethnic travel specialist) that will book and hold a ticket type that doesn’t have to be ticketed (= paid) till, say, 7 days before the flight. Or, if BA is nervous about £34k encashable (via flex ticket) possibly being awarded to you in court, then they can buy you the ticket using other airline(s) at the very considerably lower interline rates they have access to.
They’re lucky you’re not trying to push the flight out much much further, which could be reasonable. You are in a much better position because you can truly say the only barrier to your not flying what you bought is BA. You’ve accommodated them twice now when you would really have preferred to fly sooner and could have, but now you really can’t accommodate their cancelling any more and you really need to have a booking as soon as you can rearrange to fly.
Don’t let them bully you into refunding which is clearly their tactic.
Recent posts by stillinthesun, Jon and meta are good plus a good look at the Flights Cancellations and Changes threads on here but get an LBA off by registered or at least signed-for snail mail to BA Legal at Waterside asap.
- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
After 18 years it’s unlikely to be set in stone as the point is that there needs to be flexibility to adapt to the specific circumstances of each case.
BA’s standard position at CEDR/MCOL is that the statute doesn’t require the airline to hold a ticket open for the passenger indefinitely which must, in essence, be correct. They then seek to rely on the conditions of carriage and ticket validity. The judge/arbitrator has to consider the facts and make a determination. I think that for endlessly cancelled bookings to countries like Japan and China which are essentially closed, there will be some sympathy for the airlines as it might not be considered reasonable for them to be expected to hold tickets open indefinitely until the countries reopen.
While I have some sympathy for the airlines in that situation I also think that it is unfair that BA just allows a 2-4-1 voucher used to originally purchase a flight to expire. If BA is going to refund in that situation I think it would be right for BA to credit each passenger with the Avios for their ticket ie double as that is effectively what they bought, a second seat with a massive discount. That discount was at BA’s discretion, it seems fair that the passenger should be able to rebook a similar itinerary for 2 pax. That still doesn’t make it totally equitable as refunding means that rebooking then requires reward seat availability which on some routes is a very slim chance. The other issue is that it is within BA’s control as to whether they restart flights to the destination. The recent issues with cancellation of the LHR-BKK route is a case in point – BA is wrongly trying to strong-arm passengers to go for a refund rather than automatically re-routing. It is against the spirit of the rules when they notify in advance that the route is no longer for sale but then don’t actually cancel reservations for months afterwards meaning that passenger choice is limited. So forgive me if I favour the passenger’s rights over the airlines.
PS Even if BA would agree to do what is fair, and give you, say, a new 241 voucher valid for a year, be very wary as any amount of refund you get is probably going to be too low to rebook that same trip.
If your true aim here is to get the voucher back and use it for a different trip then maybe. Otherwise you currently have the right to replacement ickets, in full, at no extra cost to yourself regardless of the fact that fares have increased massively and that’s worth far more.
I am sure BA would bite your hand off to give you a completely new full-validity 241 voucher as well if that would let them get away with just refunding you what you paid, but they are worried about the precedent that would create for anyone with a 241 booking they cancel. So they are just contenting themselves with trying to bully you into a refund.
Somebody posted the other day that they were awarded £5k by the judge for refused re-routing. The passenger bought a flex ticket and took BA to MCOL.
BA argued ticket validity and that it can be extended indefinitely plus and said that if they award £5k then the passenger in question could just cancel and pocket the money and not fly at all. The judge told them that they could, but it’s their right and awarded £5k.
The ticket cost is minimal if you book a flex ticket with a good travel agent. You could just pay a deposit and they’ll hold a ticket for you. The court fee is of course another matter.
Somebody posted the other day that they were awarded £5k by the judge for refused re-routing. The passenger bought a flex ticket and took BA to MCOL.
BA argued ticket validity and that it can be extended indefinitely plus and said that if they award £5k then the passenger in question could just cancel and pocket the money and not fly at all. The judge told them that they could, but it’s their right and awarded £5k.
The ticket cost is minimal if you book a flex ticket with a good travel agent. You could just pay a deposit and they’ll hold a ticket for you. The court fee is of course another matter.
That’s great news. Can you post the link? I have 4 first class tickets cancelled by BA.Claiming tickets cost with other airlines would cost £6800 (£34k*4*5%) for the court fee… Would it be risky?
Have a search on the forum. There are a few similar cases.
I don’t see it as too much of a risk if you can show that you can enter the country and say you want to be re-routed at earliest convenience, i.e. this month or even September and BA is refusing it. There are flights going to China, so BA should put agreements in place.
Only you will know though whether you can afford to lose court fees, it can always go sideways, especially if you don’t prepare the case well.
@AmaD the case referred to was on a much smaller scale and seeking to book two years from the original whereas you want to book three years. I believe the fact that the flight cancellations are tied to the effective closure of China to most people is a very significant part of the factual matrix.
While lady litigation and meeta me in court seem very happy to encourage you to place a bet of £6,800 yes, it is potentially very risky.
If, as you said at 15.38, the principal purpose of all this is to get back two companion vouchers, you are also placing a very high price on them. Yes, you may win but it is far from certain.
I really sympathise here – I had 3 x F seats to MIA (rare as hen’s teeth, my retirement trip) cancelled at the start of the pandemic but it was what it was and my 241 had plenty of validity left (I think we ended up using it for F to BOS in March). It’s not the OP’s fault that BA can’t fly to China.
I think I would at least want the value of the companion vouchers back but I can’t see BA agreeing to this without a fight, and of course this isn’t specifically provided for under EU261 or any other consumer protection. However, as we all recall, the value of the 241 HAS been recognised in cases of downgrading, so in theory it should be taken into account when it comes to a refund of a cancelled booking. Of course it took legal action to achieve the former result!You could always go to court for the value of the voucher as a breach of contract. You don’t have to rely on EC261. BA can’t fulfil the contract so they should put you whole.
You could even go for S75 claim and make Amex rebook you on any airline in F.
- This reply was modified 55 years, 4 months ago by .
I sympathise here and am currently waiting for a response to my 2nd complaint to BA. My SIN flight was cancelled in 2020, not re-routed (SIN was closed at the time, but wasn’t offered anyway) BA held my booking and CV, but I couldn’t access anything online, only call. Both CV and ticket expired. Needless to say it literally took a year to get in touch with them. I’m now giving them a few more weeks to respond then I’m taking legal action to get the value of the voucher back.
I sympathise here and am currently waiting for a response to my 2nd complaint to BA. My SIN flight was cancelled in 2020, not re-routed (SIN was closed at the time, but wasn’t offered anyway) BA held my booking and CV, but I couldn’t access anything online, only call. Both CV and ticket expired. Needless to say it literally took a year to get in touch with them. I’m now giving them a few more weeks to respond then I’m taking legal action to get the value of the voucher back.
I’m not sure I fully understand your post as you only mention the CV in your old booking (nothing re Avios or cash) and potentially taking legal action for its value. I don’t think there is any prospect of bringing a successful standalone legal claim for the value of the CV/241 as BA has been very generous both in various six month extensions and rolling CVs into FTVs valid until Sep 2023. There has been plenty of opportunity to use it.
For you, the value of the CV only lies in the UK261 rerouting rights you had in 2020 when your flights to SIN were cancelled, but I fear that having not really pursued the matter for two years it’s going to be quite hard to revive that rerouting claim now, even if you are technically entitled to it. BA certainly won’t agree to it at this stage and I’m not sure how sympathetic a court would be to a claim lodged two years on with apparently little interim communication. The standard BA defence re ‘open’ tickets is quite likely to prevail.
While you say “it literally took a year to get in touch with them” that doesn’t really stand up to scrutiny, difficult though BA can be to communicate with and by having essentially acquiesced and not pursued them your claim is getting progressively harder. You suggest giving them a few more weeks – don’t! You need to decide now whether you have the tenacity and writing skills to go to MCOL or the gentler CEDR route, either preceded by a Letter before Claim sent by registered post to BA legal, setting out your claim in a clear, succinct, unemotional manner giving BA 14 days to respond failing which you will pursue the matter at MCOL/CEDR.
AF-KL permit date change only 30 days from the cancelled flight. Is this lawful? If it’s not, why do the CAA permit it?
Why have all these cases going to ADR when they’re illegal. What a waste of everyones time and money.
Before Covid, compliance with Article 8c was +/- 3-7 days.
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