British Airways responds to my question on 2-4-1 downgrade compensation

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• mark2 says:

  3 Mar3 March 10:01

  And another thing.
  Many of us have persuaded family, friends, colleagues etc.to take the BAPP card on the basis of getting the Companion voucher. Imagine the embarrassment of this happens to one of the.

• Lloyd says:

  3 Mar3 March 10:03

  None of this surprises me. When I booked the SYD F ‘mistake’ fare last year and part paid with avios, BA refused to refund them even though they were the ones who cancelled the ticket. Ended up claimed the monetary value of the avios through small claims where they duly coughed up.

  Cant remember whether I had to sign a gag order or not but sod it!

• Joan says:

  3 Mar3 March 10:04

  Am I imagining this , or did I read somewhere that BA guarantee a minimum of two avios seats in each class on any flight ? If I haven’t imagined it , then if you are downgraded from say CW then they are not satisfying that promise

  • mark2 says:

    3 Mar3 March 10:41

    You are assuming that they only made the minimum available. When I book flights to Canada at T-355 there are often 9+ seats available in each cabin.

    • Joan says:

      3 Mar3 March 12:53

      Ah yes true .

• Rob says:

  3 Mar3 March 10:51

  Thanks for pursuing this Rob, seems a very important issue to BA’s frequent flyer community.

  • Will P says:

    3 Mar3 March 12:55

    Much appreciate you investigating this one Rob as it takes some considerable effort to accumulate a decent lump of Avios for those of us not able to launder large amounts of expenses through our credit cards.
    Makes me nervous about my current 241 booking in F to Miami which seems very popular and therefore a prime target! Keep up the pressure!!!

    • Joan says:

      3 Mar3 March 13:43

      I have a current 241 booking to Miami too Will . We are going out premium economy since no club world seats were available . Coming back club world . It’s me who got the 241 using my free BA Amex card so I had to spend £20,000 to get it . I am only bronze BA . My partner ( who’s effectively getting the ” free” seat , is Silver . We will have to see what happens

      • Genghis says:

        3 Mar3 March 13:52

        It might be worth ‘investing’ in the BAPP card instead of the free one. Assuming you can hit the 241 in 6 months, the c.£100 fee would mean you would get 5k more avios back for that £10k spend over the blue and a 241 that is valid for two years. You can then use the extra £10k spend to hit another 241 on your partner’s card or another sign up bonus. Having a voucher with two year validity means you can be much more flexible about dates and really can book at t-355 in the cabin that you want.

        • Joan says:

          3 Mar3 March 14:05

          Thanks Ghengis … I will have a think about that . Mind you I am not far off my next £20,000 spend 241 ( obviously I spend too much ! ) . But in the light of these discussions it might not be worth getting those 241s any more .

    • Mike says:

      3 Mar3 March 17:25

      You’ll be downgraded to J at worse, (unlikely) so no real hardship if the worse case scenario happens. J to PE now that’s a different challenge !!

      • Chris says:

        3 Mar3 March 22:00

        I don’t understand this response. J is for work travel. If I’ve worked my ass off for months, I expect to feel a little rewarded when I’m on my leisure time and I’ve paid for F (in Avios).

        I can’t get my holiday time back.

        • Will P says:

          7 Mar7 March 18:15

          I agree Chris….
          J is relatively affordable for those on middle incomes whilst F is a treat and probably unjustifiable on a cash booking

• Rma says:

  3 Mar3 March 11:12

  It would be very interesting to know BA’s criteria for selecting passengers for downgrading, although they are unlikely to publicise this. What is the pecking order? Business travellers, personal travellers, Blue level BA exec passengers, package holidays, staff…. who knows?
  However, by downgrading some 241 passengers and then treating them disparagingly, they have introduced an element of doubt in the value of the 241 ticket. As consumers we expect to get what we purchase and if 241 is in reality a stand by ticket, then this should be made clear in the T&C.
  Rma

• paul says:

  3 Mar3 March 11:23

  Slightly vague, so excuse me, but…(and I’ve been desperately googling it but to no avail!)
  I think I remember some years ago, on a consumer forum of some sort, possibly radio, a dispute and advice for ‘next time’ as follows, Family had booked hotel 2 bed suite but were ‘moved’ to 2 interconnecting rooms. Their argument was it materially changed their experience which they had specifically booked the rooms for, i.e.’ being in the same rooms’. Mr. radio expert mused that had the family specified to the agent at the time of booking this requirement then action could have been taken to recover costs/damages as goods supplied (rooms not suite) was not as contracted.
  So what? Well, being 6’6″ tall, I don’t travel Club World for the excellent attentive service and delicious food (I’ll leave that to Qatari), but because the prospect of a 12 hour flight in even WTP let alone WT is enough for me to decide to travel elsewhere instead, so the idea of arriving at the airport and being downgraded to WTP or WT would indeed completely ruin the holiday to an extent I would probably have cancelled instead of going.
  The question arises if this is the case, that if I book a CW/F ticket, by whichever means (AX241 or avois, or even cash) and state somehow at time of booking (by email, or in phone booking??) that CW/F is the prime reason and vital to booking, does that provide more protection by means of breach of contract as opposed to conditions of travel?
  I’ll leave that for the lawyers amongst you to decide on.

  • Lady London says:

    3 Mar3 March 22:29

    Lawyers will correct me but the phrase to used to be to say the aspect you did not want to change was ‘of the essence’.

    There’s also stuff like a written contract overrides any verbal agreement made etc. I have no idea where agreements made digitally sit but guess in this contrxt they probably count as written agreements.

    No harm in ensuring communication about what you want is clear though and that you wouldn’t be booking otherwise.

• Adam says:

  3 Mar3 March 11:24

  Frankly, BA are pushing what at best might be called an “aggressive” (think, misguided) interpretation of EU 261/2004 here. As we know, EU legislation is interpreted purposively. There are plenty of examples of this, but in the context of EU 261/2004, have a look and try and find where the provision setting out a right to fixed level of compensation for a delay (only, rather than cancellation). It wasn’t explicitly there in the text: it was a purposive interpretation of Regulation, bearing in mind the principle of equal treatment.

  The purpose of the Article 10 requirement for compensation is clearly to prevent airlines from unnecessarily downgrading passengers. Suggesting that the “free” (in Avios terms) passenger on a 2-4-1 booking can be downgraded with no compensation due gives BA an essentially free option to continue selling (or overselling). This clearly increases the risk of unnecessary downgrades, and so subverts the purpose of Article 10.

• Simmo says:

  3 Mar3 March 11:28

  What happens to the £500 odd taxes and fees that the companion pays? does this apply for the EU 75% refund?

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