Flight delayed and moved to flight on lower class

[Ori]

I have to say, BA really are shockingly poor.

My flight from Geneva got cancelled. The rebooked me the following day on economy rather than business. It’s an avios flight so I presume I will get a refund of avios points?

Seriously though BA…….call the number given and it just says they are busy and hangs up on you.
Ground staff haven’t got a clue and I ended up booking my own hotel as that’s what they advised me to do.
I asked them what’s the budget for a hotel and they just shrugged.

Not impressed. Hopefully get compensation and a return of my avios points.

[dougzz99]

It’s poor, and I’ll not pretend otherwise. But it’s fairly normal when things go wrong that the problems just multiply. If you post here you’ll read lots of threads about how poor BA with contacting them. They say £200 for a hotel, but that’s flexible if it’s an expensive city or hotels at that time are. If it’s over £200 good idea to screenshot hotels.com or similar showing all hotels are expensive. You can claim other expenses too, meals (not alcohol), cost of phone, internet.
Downgrade refund is I believe 75% of fare, assume that applies to Avios too.
If delay is not exceptional then you should get compo too.

As someone time rich I rather enjoy something like this, some cash back, nice hotel on BA’s dime. All good.

[BA Flyer IHG Stayer]

It would be a reimbursement of 30% of the fare for a flight this short.

75% is for long haul

[Ori]

Thanks for replies. Was basically after some sympathy! 😉

30% avios fare refund is about the same as the difference between economy and business.

You think I can claim for the extra parking fine at airport? Just realised I’m going to be hit with that when I land later today.

I’m not sure I’ll be entitled to compensation as they said due to weather. Don’t understand as easyJet and other airlines were still flying and the flight 1 hour before mine left on time. They cancelled my flight 7 hours before it was scheduled to depart which indicates to me it’s more of a staffing issue?

[NorthernLass]

Is the arrival airport LHR? They had problems with high winds yesterday BUT someone else posted that BA are indeed having staffing issues in another thread. Make a note of which other flights were departing and arriving around the same time as this would be important evidence for a compensation claim if you decide to pursue that.

Is it a parking fine or just an extra day’s charge? Have you tried to change your booking or contact the parking company, of there’s a way of doing that? This may fall under consequential losses and be something for your insurance though I’m not 100% sure.

[Ori]

Thanks. EasyJet, and in fact BA had a flight land and hour before mine was scheduled to land, but it was my flight that was cancelled 7 hours before so can’t be because of weather…..well maybe indirectly as they had staffing issues that couldn’t be moved?

I’m just not impressed with BA leaving people stranded with no way of actually speaking to them. It’s very poor.

I was travelling alone. What if I was a family of 4 or 5. Stranded in Geneva and just told “book yourself a hotel”. What if I couldn’t afford it?

BA Is supposed to be a premium airline.

[Andrew.]

Ori wrote:

Thanks. EasyJet, and in fact BA had a flight land and hour before mine was scheduled to land, but it was my flight that was cancelled 7 hours before so can’t be because of weather…..well maybe indirectly as they had staffing issues that couldn’t be moved?

I’m just not impressed with BA leaving people stranded with no way of actually speaking to them. It’s very poor.

I was travelling alone. What if I was a family of 4 or 5. Stranded in Geneva and just told “book yourself a hotel”. What if I couldn’t afford it?

BA Is supposed to be a premium airline.

You were in a first world City on a day when high winds made landing safely difficult at your destination, a major international airport airport.

Lots of anxious “what ifs” there.

Given what you have written, if you were asked if you were “resilient” at a job interview do you feel now you could honestly reply “yes”?

[dougzz99]

I don’t think there are any premium airlines when it comes to customer service, the way of the world now it seems. Apologies for getting the downgrade refund wrong.

The problem with weather delays is things become hard to prove. If an airport restricts flow as a result of wind, like LHR yesterday, then airlines choose which flights to cancel, so even if others flew it doesn’t prove it wasn’t weather related. BA typically cancels domestics first, then moves the higher frequency short haul destinations.

Honestly hard to imagine anyone ‘stranded’ in Geneva, given the price of anything there. I get the broader point, but some personal responsibility needs to be exercised by people too.

[stevenhp1987]

Ori wrote:

You think I can claim for the extra parking fine at airport? Just realised I’m going to be hit with that when I land later today

Are you parked in official LHR car parks? I’ve never been hit with the daily charge for being a day late due to flight delays. It’s just opened the barrier and let me through.

Even if you are charged, it’s one for your travel insurance and not BA.

[NorthernLass]

Stranded in a sea of fondue and Toblerone maybe? When we went to Geneva a few years ago we stayed at a pretty decent airport hotel (NH, IIRC), as they were far and away the most reasonably priced and a short tram ride from the city.

[Ori]

Andrew. wrote:

Ori wrote:

Thanks. EasyJet, and in fact BA had a flight land and hour before mine was scheduled to land, but it was my flight that was cancelled 7 hours before so can’t be because of weather…..well maybe indirectly as they had staffing issues that couldn’t be moved?

I’m just not impressed with BA leaving people stranded with no way of actually speaking to them. It’s very poor.

I was travelling alone. What if I was a family of 4 or 5. Stranded in Geneva and just told “book yourself a hotel”. What if I couldn’t afford it?

BA Is supposed to be a premium airline.

You were in a first world City on a day when high winds made landing safely difficult at your destination, a major international airport airport.

Lots of anxious “what ifs” there.

Given what you have written, if you were asked if you were “resilient” at a job interview do you feel now you could honestly reply “yes”?

What a patronising comment.
Yes it’s first world problems. However, my point was of poor customer service.
Yes I was able to quite happily sort my situation out because I have the means and ability, but others aren’t always able to. A large family or maybe someone vulnerable?

British airways is a premium brand and to just not help people when they cancel flights is shockingly poor.
Phone lines that you can’t get through. As I said, I’m fine, but where is the help for those who aren’t able?

[Ori]

stevenhp1987 wrote:

Ori wrote:

You think I can claim for the extra parking fine at airport? Just realised I’m going to be hit with that when I land later today

Are you parked in official LHR car parks? I’ve never been hit with the daily charge for being a day late due to flight delays. It’s just opened the barrier and let me through.

Even if you are charged, it’s one for your travel insurance and not BA.

Spot on as it turns out. Barrier just opened up without issue.

[Ori]

dougzz99 wrote:

I don’t think there are any premium airlines when it comes to customer service, the way of the world now it seems. Apologies for getting the downgrade refund wrong.

The problem with weather delays is things become hard to prove. If an airport restricts flow as a result of wind, like LHR yesterday, then airlines choose which flights to cancel, so even if others flew it doesn’t prove it wasn’t weather related. BA typically cancels domestics first, then moves the higher frequency short haul destinations.

Honestly hard to imagine anyone ‘stranded’ in Geneva, given the price of anything there. I get the broader point, but some personal responsibility needs to be exercised by people too.

Truth be told, the fare refund isn’t that big a deal for me. Might feel different if it was a long haul flight.

Reality is that Geneva isn’t really a problem. Lots of airport hotels, but I can think of plenty of airports like in Denmark, where one would really struggle during holiday season.

The main point is just the poor customer service and no one to talk to. I just expect more from
British airways. I mean they guy just said. Book yourself a hotel and I said what’s the budget “I don’t know. I don’t work for BA”.

[Lady London]

@Ori thank you for mentioning that. I would definitely be vulnerable in such a position. I’m sure it’s nicer to sleep on the floor of Geneva airport than some third world airport, but still $hitty. One can take precautions but no one can cover everything, And as you said, what about non-rich families with young children?

[JDB]

@Ori – you are correct in that the system only works for those with means and some nous. Some people would argue whether BA is a ‘premium’ airline but you will find that most of the time, most European legacy carriers will adopt exactly the same policy as BA – sort yourself out and we’ll consider your claim later. It’s been the case for 10+ years. Airlines no longer wish to be in the business of booking / paying directly for hotels, taxis etc. even at their home basis and they don’t have sufficient or sufficiently trained staff anyway. It’s very common to outsource agents at outstations and they may wear BA uniforms but they are not employees, are paid peanuts, have no authority to agree any payments and probably don’t care too much either. Welcome to real world European air travel.

[Ori]

JDB wrote:

@Ori – you are correct in that the system only works for those with means and some nous. Some people would argue whether BA is a ‘premium’ airline but you will find that most of the time, most European legacy carriers will adopt exactly the same policy as BA – sort yourself out and we’ll consider your claim later. It’s been the case for 10+ years. Airlines no longer wish to be in the business of booking / paying directly for hotels, taxis etc. even at their home basis and they don’t have sufficient or sufficiently trained staff anyway. It’s very common to outsource agents at outstations and they may wear BA uniforms but they are not employees, are paid peanuts, have no authority to agree any payments and probably don’t care too much either. Welcome to real world European air travel.

Very true what you say here. However, if we are getting easyJet service (not putting Eastjet down as they are low cost plus in my book, but getting premium prices…….

BA is our national carrier no?

[dougzz99]

@Ori I think the tone wasn’t great, but @Andrew’s point is not invalid. Now I’m happy to be savaged by parents, but if you take kids to a foreign country, there is parental responsibility to have to means to deal with situations that may occur.

@JDB pretty much nails it.
I think the reality is you have to adjust what you expect from BA, because if you continue to use them, they’ll continue to perform as in this example. If you choose to use someone else you’ll generally find that BA standards of customer service are the norm.

[Ori]

Lady London wrote:

@Ori thank you for mentioning that. I would definitely be vulnerable in such a position. I’m sure it’s nicer to sleep on the floor of Geneva airport than some third world airport, but still $hitty. One can take precautions but no one can cover everything, And as you said, what about non-rich families with young children?

I was staying with a friend who had a brain injury from a car crash and while she functions well, she does suffer massively from anxiety when situations change and becomes overwhelmed. My thoughts were, what if she was there. She wouldn’t be able to handle it.
Not everyone is just able to book a hotel on their Amex and not worry about the ramifications.

And as has been pointed out that this was in Geneva, there are plenty of airports where the situation would have been a lot harder to deal with and the lack of help from BA is concerning.

[dougzz99]

Ori wrote:

Very true what you say here. However, if we are getting easyJet service (not putting Eastjet down as they are low cost plus in my book, but getting premium prices…….

BA is our national carrier no?

BA are a US centric airline based in London. Maybe there’s an argument they’re London’s airline but national carrier is a stretch.

EasyJet prices are very similar to BA on a like for like basis.

[Ori]

dougzz99 wrote:

@Ori I think the tone wasn’t great, but @Andrew’s point is not invalid. Now I’m happy to be savaged by parents, but if you take kids to a foreign country, there is parental responsibility to have to means to deal with situations that may occur.

Well yes and no. Geneva no issue. Have you tried to book a hotel in Denmark when a flight is cancelled. Good luck with that.
I believe that any airline has a duty of care to its passengers and when flights are cancelled it should be a clear procedure which check in should be able to help with and sort.

@JDB pretty much nails it.
I think the reality is you have to adjust what you expect from BA, because if you continue to use them, they’ll continue to perform as in this example. If you choose to use someone else you’ll generally find that BA standards of customer service are the norm.

You may be right here. I will say I have much better luck getting hold of other carriers than I do BA. I understand everyone is moving to an online model, but certain issues need a human to help with.

[AJA]

I’ve read this thread with some interest. I think BA takes the attitude that it is cheaper (and from their perspective more efficient) to operate call centres that can deal with passengers 24/7, depending on which call centre you phone. The result is that they don’t have or need on airport staff dealing with issues. Instead, any on airport staff direct passengers to call the call centres.

That combined with relying on passengers either having access to credit cards (which to be fair most do) or travel insurance to pay for hotels and meals in case of irrops and then submit a claim after the event for reimbursement.

We can all agree or disagree with the methodology, but that is how BA operates today.

Our choice as consumers is either to accept this and continue to book with BA or choose to fly with any other airline. BA have worked out that there are enough new customers to make up for those who reach the end of their tether and go elsewhere.

I realise that the above doesn’t necessarily come across as customer centric, and yet I still fly BA. This is because they fly, in the main, from and to airports I want to go to. And their schedules usually suit me. I have had my share of cancellations and disruption, but thus far, I have never been left out of pocket nor not got where I needed to go.

Also, in reality, the vast majority of their flights operate without major incident. The reports we read as in this thread, are actually the minority. The reality is that the vast majority of flights where nothing goes wrong go unreported. In other words bad news is really what we hear about.

[dougzz99]

@AJA. Broadly I agree with your post. I remain Gold but a lot of contributing TP are a result of travel on AA, as despite endlessly reading how wonderful BA crews are I find them , particularly since ‘19, to be rather poor. AA crew are no better, but the food often is.
I’d suggest it is a little more than BA have chosen to operate via call centre. In my experience BA have chosen to operate via as complete as possible disconnect from the customer. Call centres largely uncontactable. They try to use IT but that is very very poor. When there is disruption it’s not like call centre staff are replacing airport staff, it’s abandon passengers and those savvy enough to know sort themselves out keeping receipts and claiming back from BA, who generally pay in these circumstances.
Whilst I’d guess the vast majority of their flights operate as expected, those that don’t when considering the full end to end experience is significant. There’s little point in an on time arrival if you then wait 2 hours for bags. There’s a building weight of feedback on FT that the ground staff shortages are biting BA again. Flights arriving and not having a stand as previous flight remains on stand awaiting baggage loading. Flights at gate but no guidance system, no one to position the air bridge. The high winds on Monday may have bought BA some relief, as it allowed weather cancellations, but around this were a good number of cancellations because they simply lack staff to operate their schedule. There’s a suggestion that on occasions HAL have towed planes on behalf of BA as they were blocking the airport operations. These staff shortages are not being solved by BA, and they remain unable to cope with staff absence because their operation is too thin.

[Lady London]

Dougzz99 : “In my experience BA have chosen to operate via as complete as possible disconnect from the customer. Call centres largely uncontactable. They try to use IT but that is very very poor. When there is disruption it’s not like call centre staff are replacing airport staff, it’s abandon passengers and those savvy enough to know sort themselves out”

@Dougzz99 you are my hero. You’ve just summed up what BA has evolved to become – and I think largely deliberately.

It’s called “making the pips squeak”. Squeezing everything out, as a strategy. It’s almost as if they’ve been bought out by private equity.

[BA Flyer IHG Stayer]

dougzz99 wrote:

Ori wrote:

Very true what you say here. However, if we are getting easyJet service (not putting Eastjet down as they are low cost plus in my book, but getting premium prices…….

BA is our national carrier no?

BA are a US centric airline based in London. Maybe there’s an argument they’re London’s airline but national carrier is a stretch.

EasyJet prices are very similar to BA on a like for like basis.

The concept of a “national carrier” went out of the window decades ago and is meaningless in this day and age.