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  • bomba 34 posts

    “We are pleased to inform you that our partnership with Japan Airlines, our strategic oneworld partner, has been expanded. Starting 31 March 2024, Japan Airlines will offer daily flights to and from Haneda to Doha.

    As a result of this enhancement, changes will be made to the flight schedule for your upcoming trip. The flight(s) that you booked with Qatar Airways will now be operated by Japan Airlines.”

    I received the above email regarding my QR flight from LHR – DOH – HND. I’m not sure if its the complete route or just DHR – HND. Is there anyway to get compensation to reduce the avios / £ fines as I’d rather sit qsuite than JAL business especially since its not the new A350 deliveries they recently received which I’d like to try. Just wondering your guys thoughts. TIA 🙂

    Gavin454 177 posts

    It will just be for the DOH – HND leg. QR swap planes around all the time, QSuite is not guaranteed. However, I believe QR will swap you to another flight that has QSuite for free, if one is available and you request that. I doubt you’d get any compensation.

    JDB 4,631 posts

    @bomba – a change of flight operator, even if it involves a change of (primary) flight number does not give rise to any statutory rights re compensation,refund or rerouting. QR does sometimes allow rebooking if a booked flight no longer has QSuites, so you could call them to check any options they may offer as a matter of goodwill.

    Regulators do not require airlines to entertain any claims about the supposed difference in quality between business class on different airlines.

    bomba 34 posts

    On google flights / sky scanner I can still see that QR is operating my flight? Would this be a delay in them updating the schedule?
    Also thanks to @Gavin454 and @JDB for your input, at the moment it seems qatar login page is dead (of course the timing) so once its back I will ask them about it. Thanks again!

    Scotty665 32 posts

    Exact same email received here for HND – DOH – EDI….No further info yet received on the actual flight they have moved me onto. Will see what that is and then take it from there. Originally booked this route for QSuite and to avoid the BA 787 Ying Yang… Although Now BA seem to be using an A350 on one of the flights.

    yonasl 976 posts

    I will pick JL over QR anytime!

    JDB 4,631 posts

    Exact same email received here for HND – DOH – EDI….No further info yet received on the actual flight they have moved me onto. Will see what that is and then take it from there. Originally booked this route for QSuite and to avoid the BA 787 Ying Yang… Although Now BA seem to be using an A350 on one of the flights.

    Bear in mind that on that return routing you have no UK261 rights as it’s a flight from a third country on a third country carrier, so if you want to change anything it’s a matter of negotiation/goodwill, nothing QR is obliged to offer.

    bomba 34 posts

    I will pick JL over QR anytime!

    Whys that haha? Really wanted to experience qsuite long haul rather than just LHR – DOH

    C2K77 11 posts

    Now I’d argue that the OP has no contract with JAL so cannot be compelled to fly on them. The route has not been pulled ( although that itself would trigger ‘right to alternate carrier’ and their ability to decline any QR flight offered that they had legitimate reason to find unacceptable. Which obstensibly is validated by saying “that flight won’t work for me* )

    He has been offloaded to a different carrier purely to benefit the airlines involved. It occurred without prior warning or opportunity to give his own preferences. He has no contract with JAL & has not expressed his desire to fly with or make use of their services at this, or the flight itinerary’s schedule. JAL and QR were alliance partners prior to the booking and the date of this forced and non consensual action taken without his agreement and in breach of the contract made between himself and QR. The two airlines further developing the agreements and integration is of no consequence and/or interest to the pax. The contract was not made subject to an EXPLICIT AND HIGHLIGHTED TERM specifically agreed to and recorded that shows the pax understanding and agreement that QR may move his flights to another carrier without further notice for any reason. Upto and including a real or perceived personal benefit to the contracted party ( QR) and/or any other entity of their choosing and at a time of their choosing.

    Nowhere does there exist any such weighted term that both imposes a forced change of business entity, denies the other ( pax) party pre resolution or exit without penalty or grants one party ( QR) the right to summarily release itself from agreed terms and assign a third party of their sole decision in their place whilst stating, implying, or by way of non disclosure to the other party, mislead them to believe said contract remains valid,was not broken and that the 2nd party is in anyway obligated to the initial terms AND now to those of the assigned 3rd party & leaving them potentially exposed to additional penalties levied by the 1st ( QR) despite their actions by definition falsely claiming a loss of obligations as well as the 3rd party ( JAL) to whom he has no business, agreement or liability.

    Can they cancel the booking if the pax highlights both QRs breach of contract and unauthorized & invalid actions – YES.
    Would the pax then have cause to seek redress/ arbitration – YES and QR haven’t got much they can use to mitigate. Not to mention that anything would, you would hope, be deemed all but irrelevant when placed against the actions they’ve taken.

    JDB 4,631 posts

    @C2K77 – your comments are all fine and dandy but unfortunately are simply wrong and offer no assistance to the OP. The pax will have a contract with JL; that is well established by the CJEU. On your analysis, if BA cancels a flight and rebooks you on AA, you have no contract which is, of course, nonsense.

    I don’t know where this contract was struck, but if in the UK, air tickets on their own are not ‘consumer contracts’ so CRA 2015 doesn’t apply, so you need to fall back on other statutes/rights. As mentioned above, the CAA says passengers can’t claim for the distinctions between the standard of different business classes. Imagine if that were arguable.

    You will find also that airline contracts or conditions of condition actually commit airlines to very little beyond the requirements of the Montreal Convention so you are falling back on implied terms. The niceties of different seat types don’t really enter into it. [on a separate note, QSuite is good but nothing to get too excited about; these things get so over hyped they are likely to lead to disappointment]

    In your last para you refer to arbitration for the OP to seek redress but QR doesn’t offer arbitration! This will be resolved by negotiation, not litigation.

    Scotty665 32 posts

    Update from my side…My booking was originally made on the BA site but on a QR flight. Reason for this was because of BA’s IT, the taxes and charges were cheaper than on Qatar’s site….

    I have popped onto the live chat with BA and they have moved me to Tokyo NRT airport which QR are still flying from with QSuite (for just now anyway).

    Hopefully that is the last of the changes as my outbound leg has moved about 5 times from ABZ – LHR – HND! Although it did move to Club suite so cant complain on that front 🙂

    bomba 34 posts

    I booked on Qatar for the reason of ease in case something happens, how much was the taxes on BA’s site? I’m guessing you also did LHR – DOH – HND, I also am still unable to login into QR, anyone else facing this problem?

    Aston100 1,446 posts

    I booked on Qatar for the reason of ease in case something happens, how much was the taxes on BA’s site? I’m guessing you also did LHR – DOH – HND, I also am still unable to login into QR, anyone else facing this problem?

    Can’t login to the website.
    The Android app is working fine.

    danimal 100 posts

    I will pick JL over QR anytime!

    Whys that haha? Really wanted to experience qsuite long haul rather than just LHR – DOH

    Read JAL Apex reviews – it’s one of the best Business seats and service there is. Easily comparable to Qatar, and if you like Japanese food a real treat.

    Scotty665 32 posts

    I booked on Qatar for the reason of ease in case something happens, how much was the taxes on BA’s site? I’m guessing you also did LHR – DOH – HND, I also am still unable to login into QR, anyone else facing this problem?

    Hey – So my outbound is Aberdeen – LHR – HND on BA. The return leg on a separate booking was HND – DOH – Edinburgh. The return leg with Qatar was £50.50 in taxes per person booked on the BA site. It was more on the Qatar site as I remember checking both.

    I spoke to BA this morning and they have moved me to NRT – DOH -EDI now and it is in R class instead of U (Reward) I am hoping ill actually maybe now earn some Avios out of this! One word of warning if you don’t hold BA Status, The free seat selection doesn’t apply on R class that BA rebook you on. I have raised a complaint on this with them as the agent didn’t actually tell me this and that he was moving me to R class. I doubt they will do anything as I am waiting 3 months for a refund in Avios for a previous downgrade.

    JDB 4,631 posts

    I booked on Qatar for the reason of ease in case something happens, how much was the taxes on BA’s site? I’m guessing you also did LHR – DOH – HND, I also am still unable to login into QR, anyone else facing this problem?

    Hey – So my outbound is Aberdeen – LHR – HND on BA. The return leg on a separate booking was HND – DOH – Edinburgh. The return leg with Qatar was £50.50 in taxes per person booked on the BA site. It was more on the Qatar site as I remember checking both.

    I spoke to BA this morning and they have moved me to NRT – DOH -EDI now and it is in R class instead of U (Reward) I am hoping ill actually maybe now earn some Avios out of this! One word of warning if you don’t hold BA Status, The free seat selection doesn’t apply on R class that BA rebook you on. I have raised a complaint on this with them as the agent didn’t actually tell me this and that he was moving me to R class. I doubt they will do anything as I am waiting 3 months for a refund in Avios for a previous downgrade.

    Isn’t the trade off that if you stay booked in ‘R’ you might get some Avios and TP whereas if you were put back in ‘U’ you won’t? That could be a fairly high price to pay for seat selection. BA has followed its (and QR’s) guidelines for rerouting by putting you in the lowest available booking class. BA also cannot force open ‘U’ reward space on QR.

    Scotty665 32 posts

    I booked on Qatar for the reason of ease in case something happens, how much was the taxes on BA’s site? I’m guessing you also did LHR – DOH – HND, I also am still unable to login into QR, anyone else facing this problem?

    Hey – So my outbound is Aberdeen – LHR – HND on BA. The return leg on a separate booking was HND – DOH – Edinburgh. The return leg with Qatar was £50.50 in taxes per person booked on the BA site. It was more on the Qatar site as I remember checking both.

    I spoke to BA this morning and they have moved me to NRT – DOH -EDI now and it is in R class instead of U (Reward) I am hoping ill actually maybe now earn some Avios out of this! One word of warning if you don’t hold BA Status, The free seat selection doesn’t apply on R class that BA rebook you on. I have raised a complaint on this with them as the agent didn’t actually tell me this and that he was moving me to R class. I doubt they will do anything as I am waiting 3 months for a refund in Avios for a previous downgrade.

    Isn’t the trade off that if you stay booked in ‘R’ you might get some Avios and TP whereas if you were put back in ‘U’ you won’t? BA has followed its (and QR’s) guidelines for rerouting by putting you in the lowest available booking class. BA also cannot force open ‘U’ reward space on QR.

    Hey JBD – You are probably right here but I think I’m just hugely frustrated by the last 3 trips I’ve taken with BA not going smoothly at all. Cancelations, Re-routings and delays. Especially with still waiting on Avios and taxes being refunded from being downgraded from Business to Economy a few months back now on a 9 hour flight…

    They might have followed there policy, but should I have asked which class I was being rebooked on? Lesson learned if so. TBH TP I really couldn’t care about as I just use BA for reward flights in Club. Avios of course Ill accept 🙂

    dshunter 59 posts

    Same has happened to me.
    Personally was quite excited about trying a different business class product.

    Lady London 2,139 posts

    “waiting on Avios and taxes being refunded from being downgraded from Business to Economy a few months back”


    @Scotty665
    please tell me you claimed the 75% reimbursement of whatever you paid for that flight, to be paid back to you, as you are entitled to under EC UK 261 legislation. Or was your flight not on a European airline AND not departing from UK or Europe (which would disqualify from the 75% reimbursement ?)

    Scotty665 32 posts

    “waiting on Avios and taxes being refunded from being downgraded from Business to Economy a few months back”



    @Scotty665
    please tell me you claimed the 75% reimbursement of whatever you paid for that flight, to be paid back to you, as you are entitled to under EC UK 261 legislation. Or was your flight not on a European airline AND not departing from UK or Europe (which would disqualify from the 75% reimbursement ?)

    Yes don’t worry I have claimed! Still waiting however on the refund being “processed”….It was part of a bigger issue in that my BA flight from LHR was actually cancelled.. Next flight was the next day however was on United and not BA…No business class available the next day on any airlines. Appeared to be a very busy day at LHR! Claimed the £500 per passenger compensation too for the cancelation (Was a defect with the luggage hold on the plane) and received this actually quite promptly. They say the avios claim is taking longer as United are also involved…No idea why as it really doesn’t have anything to do with United. I actually just sent them a chaser email this morning so we will see if I get any “Wait a few more days” reply tomorrow morning.

    Mouse 188 posts

    in the UK, air tickets on their own are not ‘consumer contracts’ so CRA 2015 doesn’t apply, so you need to fall back on other statutes/rights.

    Hi @JDB, May I ask, how and why is this? Is it case law? What is the rationale for the exclusion?

    JDB 4,631 posts

    in the UK, air tickets on their own are not ‘consumer contracts’ so CRA 2015 doesn’t apply, so you need to fall back on other statutes/rights.

    Hi @JDB, May I ask, how and why is this? Is it case law? What is the rationale for the exclusion?

    If I recall it’s in theCivil Jurisdiction and Judgments Act 1982 and there is a similar carve out in Scottish law. I’m not sure of the reason but I suspect that it’s because of the potential implications of conflict with the Montreal Convention and 261. Package holidays including a flight are included. Obviously you still have most consumer rights, but if you look eg at the BA contract it says incredibly little such that you have to rely on implied terms.

    Scotty665 32 posts

    I booked on Qatar for the reason of ease in case something happens, how much was the taxes on BA’s site? I’m guessing you also did LHR – DOH – HND, I also am still unable to login into QR, anyone else facing this problem?

    Hey – So my outbound is Aberdeen – LHR – HND on BA. The return leg on a separate booking was HND – DOH – Edinburgh. The return leg with Qatar was £50.50 in taxes per person booked on the BA site. It was more on the Qatar site as I remember checking both.

    I spoke to BA this morning and they have moved me to NRT – DOH -EDI now and it is in R class instead of U (Reward) I am hoping ill actually maybe now earn some Avios out of this! One word of warning if you don’t hold BA Status, The free seat selection doesn’t apply on R class that BA rebook you on. I have raised a complaint on this with them as the agent didn’t actually tell me this and that he was moving me to R class. I doubt they will do anything as I am waiting 3 months for a refund in Avios for a previous downgrade.

    Isn’t the trade off that if you stay booked in ‘R’ you might get some Avios and TP whereas if you were put back in ‘U’ you won’t? That could be a fairly high price to pay for seat selection. BA has followed its (and QR’s) guidelines for rerouting by putting you in the lowest available booking class. BA also cannot force open ‘U’ reward space on QR.

    Hi @JBD

    My frustration from yesterday has now calmed down slightly 🙂

    I have checked the QR calculator and looks like I’ll earn the following avios in R class
    NRT – DOH – 6,433
    DOH – EDI – 4,308

    Seat selection will now cost me £313 for both flights for 2 folk.

    So probably will be getting 21,000 ish avios between 2 people but having to pay £313 for seats.

    The seats is a big deal for me as it is an 11.5 and 7.5 hours flight and previously had the double QSuite reserved (I know the plane equipment isn’t guaranteed)

    Do you think I just suck it up or is there a case here BA really should have told me what fare class they were booking me into?

    Ps they are not budging and basically saying tough luck.

    Also would like to apologise if my post yesterday sounded a bit like a moan at you…I was still calming down from speaking to the BA agent 🙂

    Scotty665 32 posts

    UPDATE: spoke to another agent at Qatar today and they kindly reserved the seats for free… must just be the luck of the draw.

    I will now not complain about moving to R… 🙂

    Scotty665 32 posts

    Hi @JBD

    Sorry to bring up an old thread again but unfortunately things have went south again with my booking and wondering if you think there is anything I can do here….

    After speaking to Qatar about the seats and Qatar booking them, they actually then cancelled the reservation as no payment was made….

    Do you think there is actually anything I can pursue here? My main gripe is that My flight was cancelled in U class which gives the free seat selection on Qatar and then rebooked into R on another flight by the BA agent and I wasn’t told that I would then lose the seat selection benefit. I infact wasnt even told which class the fare was being rebooked into. Like I said before, it is a big deal for me as I had the double QSuite reserved on my previous flight.

    I know you said that I will earn Avios on R if they are credited to my Qatar Privilege club account, however the seat selection fee is more than the Avios value I would receive.

    BA are refusing to budge and each agent says they cant do anything. Most of the time they tell me to speak to Qatar who then say that they cant do anything as the booking is with BA and that they can assign seats for free on an R fare…

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